Cummins ISX low boost high exhaust temps [Archive] - TheDieselGarage.com

: Cummins ISX low boost high exhaust temps


bucko149
01-21-2012, 02:36 AM
I have a 2006 ISX cummins 530 hp with 433,000 miles on it. It is an EGR motor. Problem is lately since weather has started to cool up motor will sometimes loss boost of about 10 lbs and exhaust temp will climb to 1000 to 1100 degrees. You might drive 5 miles and it comes out of it. You will hear a change in the sound of the motor boost pressure will come back up to normal for pull or load and exhaust temp will come back down to normal. When it does this you will hear a difference is the sound of the motor. first time it done this truck was rolling under load and flat round with aprox 50 to 60 load on it 23lbs of boost pressure and intial exhaust gas temp of 700 degrees. I heard a change is sound and looked down and noticed low boost it was down to 13 lbs and pyrometer and climbing up and stopped around 1100 degrees. Drove about 5 miles pulled over checked around found nothing. Low power on getting back up to speed. About another 5 miles and motor changes pitch and all readings come back to normal. Boost rolled up and Exhaust temp came back down. Truck continues to due this in cool weather. If you run down south for the week, truck will no due this all week come north and it will do this all the time. 35 degrees or less and it does it. Changed out Exhaust gas pressure sensor, did not fix. Any ideas?

manasteel
01-21-2012, 03:15 PM
check the turbo see if the shaft rocks enough to hit the housing also check the boost sensor see if its plugging up

Dtech43
01-22-2012, 04:25 AM
being this is a 2006 does they truck have a DPF system? Usally when the DPf system becomes clogged it will throw throw the engine into a de rate which in turn will knock out your EGR valve and ETC.... I would check this also

legend10
01-22-2012, 04:36 AM
Needs turbo. The varible vanes are sticking

justdoug
01-22-2012, 11:52 AM
Needs turbo. The varible vanes are sticking

Could you explain what that means in a bit more detail? Also,why do you think it's happening in cold temps only? thx

Dtech43
01-22-2012, 03:56 PM
one sure way to check your turbo is through cummins insite if you have the ability. you may be having issues with the VGT actuator located on top of the turbo.

pichu2
01-22-2012, 06:01 PM
I have seen your problem.(because i have a isx too) but i think, but im not sure. the problem might be in the barometric sensor. (ambient sensor)this sensor is in the main hardener of the ecm.(in the button of compressor) its flat square sensor an has 3 wires. but if water, oil dirt get on it, and this sensor has a little hole of air read ambient,(work with turbo actuator you can see a little hose goin to turbo) if the water or hole plugged the sensor act bad. its a possibility that when you or someone washed the motor with a water pressure could have plugged up that hole. if u have laptop(insite) u need to read 20.6hg or less i believe. that for lower than 10,000 feet alt. this makes the ecm act dumb and all sensors and derated afc

bmoeller
01-23-2012, 01:29 AM
Could you explain what that means in a bit more detail? Also,why do you think it's happening in cold temps only? thx

If the one on the ISX is built like the HE351VE used on the 6.7L Cummins in the Ram trucks, it is a sliding collar that changes the geometry of the turbine housing. The soot can build up in the moving parts and the actuator can't move it properly.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FLZHj-EPj0g


In the 2nd video, you can see the turbine housing. The vanes on the turbine wheel fit in the slots of the rotating collar in the turbine housing at the left. If those slots fill with soot, the that collar can stick as well. Everything can be cleaned, but the dealers pretty much just replace them under warranty.

http://www.youtube.com/user/BraydenFleece#p/u/41/exsyhvw_6Do

Art387
01-23-2012, 06:01 AM
if u have laptop(insite) u need to read 20.6hg or less i believe. that for lower than 10,000 feet alt. this makes the ecm act dumb and all sensors and derated afc

21"Hg would be more like 8800 feet. For Bay Area in CA it needs to be about 30"Hg

Art387
01-23-2012, 07:11 AM
I have a 2006 ISX cummins 530 hp with 433,000 miles on it. It is an EGR motor. Problem is lately since weather has started to cool up motor will sometimes loss boost of about 10 lbs and exhaust temp will climb to 1000 to 1100 degrees. You might drive 5 miles and it comes out of it. You will hear a change in the sound of the motor boost pressure will come back up to normal for pull or load and exhaust temp will come back down to normal. When it does this you will hear a difference is the sound of the motor. first time it done this truck was rolling under load and flat round with aprox 50 to 60 load on it 23lbs of boost pressure and intial exhaust gas temp of 700 degrees. I heard a change is sound and looked down and noticed low boost it was down to 13 lbs and pyrometer and climbing up and stopped around 1100 degrees. Drove about 5 miles pulled over checked around found nothing. Low power on getting back up to speed. About another 5 miles and motor changes pitch and all readings come back to normal. Boost rolled up and Exhaust temp came back down. Truck continues to due this in cool weather. If you run down south for the week, truck will no due this all week come north and it will do this all the time. 35 degrees or less and it does it. Changed out Exhaust gas pressure sensor, did not fix. Any ideas?

Either turbo is going bad and can't be actuated because is sticking internally or the external actuation system is not fully functional. Here is simple test:

http://bigrigshots.com/2012/01/23/vgt-turbo-quick-check/

dynamo440
01-23-2012, 01:11 PM
Bucko149,

I have a 2006 pete 387 with an ISX 450 set at 500hp. I have your exact same problem. Dealt with it last winter too. only happens in temps below 35 deg. Boost goes low, pyro goes high and the truck has to work a lot harder. I have found if you shut the motor off (even while rolling down the road) it will run fine after restart. sometimes for an hour or sometimes for a minute! Also have noticed that the odometer looses miles when restarting while rolling(unrelated.) Also noticed in temps between 35-55 deg. on flat land while cruising under 35-50% load, boost will drop out slightly and pyro will creep up around 750 and stay there until engine load goes up or down. If you are on very flat land it will stay at 750 all day! I believe this is related to the above condition.

I run insite and what i am seeing is that the egr system is shutting down, egr valve stays closed boost cuts almost in half but it looks like the ecm does not cut the fuel to match the boost. Restart the engine and everything wakes up!

I burned up two egr coolers and 3 injector cups in the head and had to replace the head in 2011. Not sure if it was caused by the above problem but long periods of high exhaust temps are suspect. This is on a motor that was inframed in oct. of 2010.

By the way, I have replaced the turbo, turbo controller, ecm, and every sensor on the engine except egr temp and delta P.

Right now my guess is that the problem is in the egr system or the ecm programming but i could be wrong.

Rocky Mountain Cummins has their field service engineer working on my problem now. I have supplied them with several insite logs and video of my gauges when it happens. I am hoping for a fix soon and I will keep you posted.

Please tell me more about your truck and what has been done to your engine.

Thanks.

dynamo440
01-24-2012, 02:17 PM
Bucko149, Call Dan 720 226 3520. May be able to help.

JBALLELECTRONICS@SHAW.CA
01-24-2012, 11:16 PM
I have a 2006 ISX cummins 530 hp with 433,000 miles on it. It is an EGR motor. Problem is lately since weather has started to cool up motor will sometimes loss boost of about 10 lbs and exhaust temp will climb to 1000 to 1100 degrees. You might drive 5 miles and it comes out of it. You will hear a change in the sound of the motor boost pressure will come back up to normal for pull or load and exhaust temp will come back down to normal. When it does this you will hear a difference is the sound of the motor. first time it done this truck was rolling under load and flat round with aprox 50 to 60 load on it 23lbs of boost pressure and intial exhaust gas temp of 700 degrees. I heard a change is sound and looked down and noticed low boost it was down to 13 lbs and pyrometer and climbing up and stopped around 1100 degrees. Drove about 5 miles pulled over checked around found nothing. Low power on getting back up to speed. About another 5 miles and motor changes pitch and all readings come back to normal. Boost rolled up and Exhaust temp came back down. Truck continues to due this in cool weather. If you run down south for the week, truck will no due this all week come north and it will do this all the time. 35 degrees or less and it does it. Changed out Exhaust gas pressure sensor, did not fix. Any ideas?

because your engine is egr model the egr system will send back pressure and soot and heat thru your turbo.....unfortunately thats the way it performs.it will eventually clogup or break the actuator shaft in turbo
if you want to have vg turbo perform properly delete the egr system from your engine thru our tuning of ecm and either toff sensors from valve or purchase a cm870 egr cooler + valve plug kit with the ecm deletion tuning from us. dj "just tryin to save truckers money+hassles"

bucko149
01-25-2012, 03:09 AM
We pulled turbo apart and inspected, resealed it back up and installed a new actuator for the variable vains at same time installed the new exhaust gas pressure sensor. I am worried about the high temps on exhaust side and effects it has on engine life. I know were there is another 06 with same problems and he is 6 grand into his and they have not fixed a thing yet. He has replaced turbo, change all sensors, ran air inlet temp into cab to give it a higher reading, did not work though. Changed turbo controller, not ecm, they have also replaced egr, also tried a welded shut egr. They have docoumeted on the computer that turbo is derating but engine is not. They now have a cummins area tech comming to look at.

I feel that it is sensor or cracked wire or bad diode. Has been very frustrating so far no one has any ideas they just want to throw sensor at it and collect 100/hour shop rate.

dynamo440
01-25-2012, 04:55 AM
Bucko149 please call me. 720 226 3520 ask for Dan. I have the same problem now for two winters and i am desperately trying to get cummins to do something.


We pulled turbo apart and inspected, resealed it back up and installed a new actuator for the variable vains at same time installed the new exhaust gas pressure sensor. I am worried about the high temps on exhaust side and effects it has on engine life. I know were there is another 06 with same problems and he is 6 grand into his and they have not fixed a thing yet. He has replaced turbo, change all sensors, ran air inlet temp into cab to give it a higher reading, did not work though. Changed turbo controller, not ecm, they have also replaced egr, also tried a welded shut egr. They have docoumeted on the computer that turbo is derating but engine is not. They now have a cummins area tech comming to look at.

I feel that it is sensor or cracked wire or bad diode. Has been very frustrating so far no one has any ideas they just want to throw sensor at it and collect 100/hour shop rate.

dzljon
01-25-2012, 09:07 AM
I agree that the vanes in the turbo are sticking

karrot
01-25-2012, 01:51 PM
it can be cause by alot of things first check ur turbo actuator and the egr system uses a egr gas sensor its located above the exhaust manifold between cylinder 1 and 2 check it or have it replace sometimes if the sensor is starting to fail and it does not give a fault code my friend had the same problem in his isx

justdoug
01-25-2012, 08:54 PM
Has been very frustrating so far no one has any ideas they just want to throw sensor at it and collect 100/hour shop rate.[/QUOTE]

Just send the bill to CARB

dynamo440
01-27-2012, 03:06 PM
Have spoken on the phone with Bucko149 plus another person with the same problem who read this post. All 3 cases are 2006 Peterbilts. One ISX450(w/500 cal) and two ISX530s. We all think the problem is in the ecm software. We have all had our ECMs recalibrated by cummins at some point in time. I believe its a glitch in the software maybe something to do with the low nox settings? We are working with cummins engineers now to get it fixed but progress is slow so far.

Art387
01-27-2012, 03:48 PM
Dan, check this out:

https://insite.cummins.com/insite/tools/incal/index.html

it might be there, don't know how old this data base is though, didn't go thru it as yet. But if you lucky you could find out which calibration is "bad"

JBALLELECTRONICS@SHAW.CA
01-27-2012, 05:26 PM
Have spoken on the phone with Bucko149 plus another person with the same problem who read this post. All 3 cases are 2006 Peterbilts. One ISX450(w/500 cal) and two ISX530s. We all think the problem is in the ecm software. We have all had our ECMs recalibrated by cummins at some point in time. I believe its a glitch in the software maybe something to do with the low nox settings? We are working with cummins engineers now to get it fixed but progress is slow so far.

the "glitch" gentlemen is the whole emission sysytem re:egr or egr-dpf- or def sysytem. if u want to fix your engines send us your ecms for deletion tuning....problem solved.... or u can wait for cummins to tell u "theres nothing we can do" dj "just tryin to save $$ for truckers"

Art387
01-27-2012, 05:54 PM
the "glitch" gentlemen is the whole emission sysytem re:egr or egr-dpf- or def sysytem. if u want to fix your engines send us your ecms for deletion tuning....problem solved.... or u can wait for cummins to tell u "theres nothing we can do" dj "just tryin to save $$ for truckers"

Why don't you shut up when we are trying to have something important figured out? If you got nothing to say - SHUT UP

JBALLELECTRONICS@SHAW.CA
01-27-2012, 05:59 PM
Why don't you shut up when we are trying to have something important figured out? If you got nothing to say - SHUT UP

DONT BE AN *** ARTIE

Art387
01-27-2012, 06:27 PM
DONT BE AN *** ARTIE

Don' be a pushy used cars salesman and I won't be *** no more. Look, you are doing it wrong - this is very small forum with limited traffic but when someone is posting something - it's ALWAYS informative even if he just describing his own problem. Tell me JBall - what is your input? All those lies about how we all need you to deal with CM 870? Screw you. There is no need to change calibrations and pay to no one and you just USE the owners for money grab

Doing what you do you just gotta have some at least some good know-how. Share some of it, either learn from Mr Hanney and others here or get lost :mafia1:

theakerstwo
01-28-2012, 02:12 AM
Don' be a pushy used cars salesman and I won't be *** no more. Look, you are doing it wrong - this is very small forum with limited traffic but when someone is posting something - it's ALWAYS informative even if he just describing his own problem. Tell me JBall - what is your input? All those lies about how we all need you to deal with CM 870? Screw you. There is no need to change calibrations and pay to no one and you just USE the owners for money grab

Doing what you do you just gotta have some at least some good know-how. Share some of it, either learn from Mr Hanney and others here or get lost :mafia1: Thanks cause i didnt know how to say it that way.