EGR Delete and Towing - Diesel Truck Forum - TheDieselGarage.com
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post #1 of 8 (permalink) Old 10-24-2014, 05:37 PM Thread Starter
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EGR Delete and Towing

Will an EGR Cooler Delete hurt my towing?

I have a blown head gasket on my 2006 Powerstroke and the repair shop is talking me into do an EGR cooler delete, along with a slew of upgrades for $6800. I'm concerned that the EGR cooler delete will cause my rig to overheat when I'm towing my 14,000 lb Fifth Wheel. Does anyone who tows heavy loads have this mod and did it hurt towing?

I use to be a diesel mechanic 30 years ago and attended some of the factory courses on emissions. Most were for gas engines because diesels didn't require them at the time. I remember that the purpose of the EGR system was to allow metered amounts of inert gases from the exhaust to enter the combustion chamber and lower temperature caused by the leaner fuel/air mixtures. If the injection system is calibrated to work with a leaner mixture, but isn't getting the inert gases, will that cause the combustion and exhaust temps to go up?

Also, I read that the turbo is waste-gated via the EGR Cooler and that you could damage your turbo by removing the EGR cooler. The guy who wrote this was trying to sell an upgraded cooler, so I don't know how reliable this is. If the EGR Cooler is deleted, where does the waste-gated pressure go when you suddenly back off the throttle?
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post #2 of 8 (permalink) Old 10-24-2014, 06:53 PM
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Some of what you have heard is incorrect. For example the turbo waste gate, if you have one which you don't, is not via the EGR Cooler. If it is waste gated if is via the exhaust manifold. The EGR valve allows for cooler combustion temperatures by lessening the amount of oxygen there is to burn. This does not create a lean burn, which would be hotter in a gas motor. It does create a smaller burn in controlled environment. I would not hesitate to get rid of my EGR and EGR Cooler if I could get away with it in California.

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post #3 of 8 (permalink) Old 10-24-2014, 08:51 PM
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Your only risk by deleting is making the truck no longer emissions compliant. If you live in a state where testing is required or that actively pursues emissions then you may have a issue. Otherwise for towing and power you should not experience any problem unless your custom tuning isn't built for a deleted truck. You just have to make the tune writer aware when buying them.

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post #4 of 8 (permalink) Old 10-24-2014, 09:34 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Weld engineer View Post
Your only risk by deleting is making the truck no longer emissions compliant. If you live in a state where testing is required or that actively pursues emissions then you may have a issue. Otherwise for towing and power you should not experience any problem unless your custom tuning isn't built for a deleted truck. You just have to make the tune writer aware when buying them.
Thanks. There is no emission checks in Florida and I don't intend to go back to the dealer now that the truck is out of warranty. The shop that's doing the install includes a tuner with a custom tune to keep the "Check Engine" light from coming on due to the EGR cooler delete. Hopefully it re-calibrates everything to work without the EGR.
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post #5 of 8 (permalink) Old 10-24-2014, 09:38 PM Thread Starter
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Some of what you have heard is incorrect. For example the turbo waste gate, if you have one which you don't, is not via the EGR Cooler. If it is waste gated if is via the exhaust manifold. The EGR valve allows for cooler combustion temperatures by lessening the amount of oxygen there is to burn. This does not create a lean burn, which would be hotter in a gas motor. It does create a smaller burn in controlled environment. I would not hesitate to get rid of my EGR and EGR Cooler if I could get away with it in California.
The mechanic was telling me that the wastegate dumped into the intake, which makes no sense to me at all. Thanks for correcting that for me. I've been searching the internet for information on the EGR cooler delete and haven't really found anything negative about doing except that it's illegal and can cost you a hefty fine if you get caught.
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post #6 of 8 (permalink) Old 10-25-2014, 01:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mabynack View Post
The mechanic was telling me that the wastegate dumped into the intake, which makes no sense to me at all. Thanks for correcting that for me. I've been searching the internet for information on the EGR cooler delete and haven't really found anything negative about doing except that it's illegal and can cost you a hefty fine if you get caught.
If the mechanic thinks your truck has a waste gate you may want to seek a second opinion. Your turbo doesn't have a waste gate all exhaust goes thru it and flow is adjusted via variable vanes.

Early 2004 F-250 4x4 CC 6.0


2nd owner, ARP studs 1 at a time, Some parts missing in the exhaust path, BD intercooler hoses, Blue spring, MC filters, Sinister coolant filter, Exhaust manifold gaskets, WARN lockouts, Gold coolant, zoodad mod, autometer boost gauge, high idle mod, Scangauge 2, SCT X3 tuned from KEM, autometer fuel pressure gauge, Archoil 6200 in the fuel, FICM by Ed w/ATLAS40, autometer pyro gauge,'08 Alum Rear Diff cover, 5w-40 Rotella T6 w/ Archoil 9100 in it, zert in the slip joint, harpooned fuel tank, 6.4 banjos


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post #7 of 8 (permalink) Old 10-25-2014, 01:06 PM
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Trying to cool exhaust gases with the same coolant that flows through the rest of the engine doesn't make sense in my mind. I have no numbers to back it up because I never towed with the egr installed but have no issues towing without it. I bought my truck with a clogged oil cooler and the egr cooler came out at the same time. It's on the shelf just in case Florida gets greedy and starts emissions testing.

2003 F-250 CC SB FX4 Lariat Black on Gold
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post #8 of 8 (permalink) Old 10-25-2014, 03:43 PM
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(quote excerpt): Does anyone who tows heavy loads have this mod and did it hurt towing?

My buddies 06" Towboss 6.0L PowerStroke tows extremely heavy loads, it's studded and deleted with 4in exhaust and SCT custom tuning, just make sure to run a good tow tune when towing heavy. His truck has been this way for many years with no issue.

The egr system is for NOX emission control only, but does attempt to keep combustion temps below 2500F, as anything above 2500F is where NOX formation occurs during the combustion process. This holds true for diesel or gasoline engines. The 2500F threshold occurs for a split second within the combustion gasses and by the time exhaust gasses reach your exhaust manifold where most have egt probes installed, it will have cooled down into the 800-1200F range. With proper tuning remapping your injection system and an egt probe and gauge installed to keep an eye on things, you can tow all day.

Too much fuel and not enough air makes high egt's, with proper tuning you should see egt's stay under 1200-1250F under any circumstances. If you see the egt's climbing above those numbers while towing, back off the throttle some.

Harry

Jan 03' built 6.0/F250cc4wd trqsft/SCT-tuned by KEM-Performance/Garrett Powermax vg-turbo/blue spring mod/gauges=egt+boost+fuel+SG2/exhaust/airaid intake/DR 4.5 lift/dual bilsteins/315's/greasable ball joints/powerstop/smittybuilt/kc lights/high idle mod/roll-n-lock/Mobil Delvac1 ESP 5W40 with (Archoil AR9100 in the oil) and (AR6200 in the fuel)
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