Twins on my Cummins powered TopKick?? - Diesel Truck Forum - TheDieselGarage.com
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post #1 of 32 (permalink) Old 07-30-2011, 06:37 AM Thread Starter
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Twins on my Cummins powered TopKick??

I have looking real hard at what to do to get more air in to my 12v 5.9. Keep in mind this is in my GMC topkick, with a 13 speed, 3.36 gears and 245/70/19.5 tires. I haul 2-4 loads of hay a week. Empty weight is 18700#'s and loaded 42,000#'s (max). At the moment I have and HX35/16 non WG, about 2' of 3" down pipe and them 10-12' of straight 3.5".

when I have my foot into it it is running 1400* EGT's and about 28 psi boost at 2100-2300 ish rpm.

I have been looking at S364/13 with double waist gate flute and all ported. the guy wants $1500 and it is new. I have been asking a lot of guys about turbos, and so far everyone I tilted the hood for said, basicly "you have a lot of space in there run twins"

The suggestions have bee run an external waist gate before the HX35 and then an S475 or S472.

Here is what i have come up with. I can buy a S471 for $600 new from a guy, and Steed Speed builds exhaust manifold with a 44mm wastgate flange for $650 retail (http://www.steedspeed.com/t3_and_t4_...iesel_manifold).

I am looking forward to fabing his up.

Is this realistic?

I am looking to make an economic 300-350 horse and be able to haul heavy. My '05 5.9 puller hay real good, until a valve seat dropped.

Comments and suggestion would be great.

Jay Noone
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post #2 of 32 (permalink) Old 07-30-2011, 04:04 PM
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You would do better with a HT3B than a S471. The 471 is a very good newer generation turbo the problem is the HX35 is just larger enough to make things work, so the 471 will spool just about the time the 35 runs out of air. While that will work and be ok if you are wanting more power later and willing to redo your hot pipe and add a 57/65 or something about that size.

You want a little more overlap in the midrange of the map of the two turbos.

I would give strong consideration to just replacing the 5.9 with a 8.3 or a 10L. Your truck came with a 3116 cat right? It should have enough supension and front axle to support the larger engines with will give you better fuel economy and less trouble. The old rule there is no subsititute for displacement is true, larger engines just make more torque at a idle up and will not be waiting for a turbo to spool. The first thing I notice when you told us more about this truck is it's empty weight. No matter what you do that weight does not go away and your little engine will need to start it to moving ever time, if you ever drove a semi you noticed that even a OLD 300 hp NTC 855 has more than enough torque to take off bob tail in 4 or 5 gear. Well a bob tail semi weight is about 17,000. So why try to re-invent the wheel, use what everone else does and see why their are happy with what they have. There are plenty of newer large engines out there and you are over 26,001 lbs so get big, you will like it better.
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post #3 of 32 (permalink) Old 07-31-2011, 03:31 AM Thread Starter
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yeah I here you about displacement.

I wanted to put a DT466 in it, but I ended up with the cummins, and the empty weight is truck and trailer.

I have a customer with a 96 IHC, crew cab, air brake, 466E, blown Allison, That I may be able to horse trade for.

I do like the cummins 5.9 and 13 speed even the way it is, it is a lot better then the 3116.

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post #4 of 32 (permalink) Old 07-31-2011, 03:55 PM
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If I was set on towing that much load with a 5.9 I would go with,

Studs,

.020 over head gasket to drop the compression.

O-ring the head.

Coat the heat (inside) with a heat rejection coating Including the valves.

A top turbo that spools quick and flows about 50-60 lbs of air.

A bottom turbo that flows 80 to 90 lbs of air.

A heat rejection coating on the inside of the exhaust manifold, top turbo turbine housing, and hot pipe. Get the heat to the (primary) bottom turbo.

A 5 inch exhaust system.

5X14 or larger injectors and check the pump (both transfer and injection).

Set the timing to 15 - 16 degrees.

Add a Cam and Good valve springs with max rpms about 3000. No need to go higher you have a 13 speed and should only drop 400 rpms between gears.

You can see it would cost just about as much as finding a lager motor a DT466 is a good motor with lots of part to help performance.

With the Medium Duty Truck market being what it is now you may be just as well off to trade up?
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post #5 of 32 (permalink) Old 09-25-2011, 11:41 AM
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Drive a electronic 466 before you buy one. The ones I've drove are gutless. You are really pulling to much for a 5.9. The 8.3's are a decent motor for the weight your running. I have a m11 in a dump truck I gross 52,000 on and it handles that weight well. I've been up around 70,000 with a trailer but wouldn't want to head accross country at that weight. It's all about torque and cubic inches.

01,qcsb,fwd,he351-3b twins,125 horse injectors,adrenaline pulse,5 inch ex. to 5 in. stacks,on board air,5 disk convertor
02 qcsb,fwd,35-40,edge juice,mach 2.5 injectors,4 inch exhaust,billet trans, 4 disk convertor
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post #6 of 32 (permalink) Old 10-23-2011, 02:29 AM
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Well those 3:36 gears aren't helping any. Plus your tires are around 35" also. Heavy loads and high gearing puts more load on the engine. The 13 speed covers up the bad gears on take off. When you get into the higher gears. Those gears are loading the engine hard.

Your also running an undersize exhaust system. With a HX35 or H1C on a 1st gen a true 4" exhaust is worth a 100 degree drop in EGt's. Your only using a 3" down pipe to a 3.5 system with a lot of long piping. I would open the system up to a 4" or bigger all the way back.

If your thinking of the twins to turn the power up more. A bigger engine would be the most cost effective option. You installed a class 3 engine into a class 5 truck. Trying to run the class 3 engine maxed out to do a class 5 job. Is going to keep eating into the billfold most likely.

93 W350 w/duals, fuel pin turned, 6X.018" injectors, 4" exhaust, 3" air intake horn, HX40/16, G56 /SBC Con-OFE, 307's axles' 2" skyjacker lift, B&W flatbed
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post #7 of 32 (permalink) Old 10-24-2011, 04:33 AM Thread Starter
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update

Last week I put a S362 with a ported 12cm housing, about 14" of 3.5" SS flex pipe and then 5" the rest of the way. EGT's are way down, if I kept the R's above 2100-2200, max EGT's were about 1250. If I let it get down around 1800-2000 the EGT's would climb to 1400 in a long hill. I grossed out at 40,500 today. The power was much better with this turbo setup.

The other day I hauled 5 horses in a 24' aluminum stock trailer and 30 bales of hay on the truck between the sleeper and trailer, one way to S. Carolina. I ran about 65 mph tops (followed the lady who owned the horses) I pulled easier than my empty hay trailer, I did not weight it.

I got 16.2 mpg going down there.

I traveled home about 75 (and a little 80+) mph with no trailer on got just shy of 12 mpg. I was short on time getting back home.

I also think that the because the hay was pretty much touching the sleeper and the front of the trailer it took up the air gap. I wounder what I could get running 60 mph empty?

I looked at a few Freightliners with 11.1 liter 60 series, direct 10 speed. A few weeks ago. Thinking about going that route for hauling hay and this Topkick for small loads and hauling horses.

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post #8 of 32 (permalink) Old 10-25-2011, 12:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hayjayhorses View Post
I looked at a few Freightliners with 11.1 liter 60 series, direct 10 speed. A few weeks ago. Thinking about going that route for hauling hay and this Topkick for small loads and hauling horses.
Good option there. Bigger engine, more torque, Your not stressing the chassis to hard. It would live longer than your maxed out HD chassis. Finding parts on the road for repairs is better.

93 W350 w/duals, fuel pin turned, 6X.018" injectors, 4" exhaust, 3" air intake horn, HX40/16, G56 /SBC Con-OFE, 307's axles' 2" skyjacker lift, B&W flatbed
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post #9 of 32 (permalink) Old 10-25-2011, 04:34 AM Thread Starter
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yeah I like that brakes are $40 per weel and $90 per drum for air bake trucks.

I still want to put twins on the 5.9 Topkick

Jay Noone
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post #10 of 32 (permalink) Old 10-27-2011, 12:00 PM
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In your search for a bigger tractor. Make sure to find one with a Jake on it. Then your not going to be worried about brake jobs. A Jake setup properly will extend brake life a lot.

93 W350 w/duals, fuel pin turned, 6X.018" injectors, 4" exhaust, 3" air intake horn, HX40/16, G56 /SBC Con-OFE, 307's axles' 2" skyjacker lift, B&W flatbed
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