Efi Live? - Diesel Truck Forum - TheDieselGarage.com
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post #1 of 34 (permalink) Old 08-27-2007, 08:34 PM Thread Starter
 
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Efi Live?

How much more horse can you get out of efi live? I know ppe and quadzilla can give you an additional 200 and something horse supposedly, but my question is what all do you have to do to get this extra 200 horses. I mean wouldn't you need to be fueling a lot more than stock, so that would require a lift pump, maybe a modified cp3, and maybe a larger turbo. I'm not trying to make anyone mad, but how many people on here have actually dyno'd their trucks to find out if their actually getting the extra 200hp that is advertised on some of these programmers, chips, or tuners
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post #2 of 34 (permalink) Old 08-27-2007, 08:37 PM Thread Starter
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B/c I believe that with efi live it actually does add the extra horse with a few minor mods, but I was wondering what about edge, or bullydog, or ppe that claim to give you this much additional horse. Why doesn't it say you may need to add a lift pump, or do some minor mods? I think that is what confuses some people that are new to diesels. THey think that if i add this tuner, turn it up to its highest tune that I automatically have 200 extra horse.
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post #3 of 34 (permalink) Old 08-27-2007, 09:12 PM
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You have to understand something about EFILive....it is primarily a scanning and diagnostic tool to allow you to use your computer like a Tech2. The side benefit that came out of it was that you could change engine parameters, and therefore "write" new tunes for your engine. This then became the BIG selling point for EFI with the racing crowd...how cool is it that you can change your tunes easily at the track, or even change one item? IMO, if you take the time and learn how to tune, you can see more (and larger) power gains using EFI than by using a regular tuner.
But, to get good at EFI tuning, you have to experiment with a LOT of different tables in the engine programming to write a tune. This takes a while, and takes lots of logging, and in some cases, lots of dyno time. Thats the reason I did not go with it myself. Maybe in the future.

Look at McRat....Pat had to experiment with a lot of different tunes to find what would work and what wouldn't. Look at Bobo....he's put in 100's of hours of work on his truck, writing tunes.

EFI is really not for the "average" guy looking for a quick program to load into his truck for more power. To do that, you'd need to buy a program from someone else, and use your EFI cable to load it into your ECM. I would highly recommend EFILive to anyone who wants to put the work into writing his own tunes. It is overall one of the best tools out there.
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post #4 of 34 (permalink) Old 08-27-2007, 09:18 PM Thread Starter
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I know what your saying, and I realized that. Thats why I don't have efi live I really don't have the time right now to mess around with it, but I still think its a great tool to use. But I guess what I'm trying to say is. That a lot of these programmers, and chips say that if you put this on your truck you will an x amount more of horse, but what they don't tell people is that if you don't do some minor mods then your not going to get into the higher horsepower ranges that they advertise
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post #5 of 34 (permalink) Old 08-28-2007, 01:28 PM
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I am going to disagree with some statements here. I can assure you that you can fairly easily tune your truck in 10 minutes, with a minimum of experience and information, and without buying a tune from anyone. It is not much more difficult than making breakfast. I have 2-3 tunes I give away. Getting over the intimidation of changing something is the first step. Logging does help the learning curve and is a necessary step to writing your own "worthy" tunes, as Tom states.

To be clear, no tuning source can overcome the hardware limitation that you point out cumminskiller. Fuel is a requirement for hot tunes, no doubt, and EFI offers any capacity you want, all within the same limitation of the fuel and air hardware you are using. EFI becomes so much more than a tuner in the sense that all handhelds are simple power devices that mainly throw a new mix of fuel, boost and timing together. EFI allows you to manipulate timing, for example, based on IAT. This is something none of the handhelds do. Just an example.

I found that I learned a lot by looking at what the various handhelds do. You can peek right into any of them, and see what XYZ did to get "200 HP".

With the support that is offered, it is a snap. I also present basic understanding of diesel combustion theory, and even advanced combustion tuning theory, all free. But I do try to discourage anyone who does not use a computer routinely. That would be a little scary.

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post #6 of 34 (permalink) Old 08-28-2007, 08:44 PM Thread Starter
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I know what your saying, and I'm not trying to be critical or anything. I'm just saying alot of people that get a diesel and think that if they put a programmer on it that says on the box that it will give them 220 more horse, that they think just by putting that on their truck they'll get that much horse without any other upgrades. ALot of my buddies back home are like that, but I keep trying to tell them thats not how it works. Also, anybody know where's a good place to get efi live?
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post #7 of 34 (permalink) Old 08-28-2007, 08:54 PM
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oh no. trans, exhaust, maybe an intake will be the support EFI needs to get to 500rwhp.

then you'll need rods, pistons, cam, heads, turbo(s), etc etc etc to go higher than that.


Michael, I wasn't trying to knock EFI or its capabilities. Its just so many people want tunes "yesterday" that I doubt they'd have the patience to go through the pains to write one using EFI. Yeah, I know you could easily copy other tuners using it, but I didn't want to open that subject.
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post #8 of 34 (permalink) Old 08-28-2007, 09:04 PM
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I was definately not suggesting copyright infringement. Not at all, and I know you are correct.

You can make a substantial improvement to SOTP by changing 3 cells in a fueling table. That's what i was getting at. Then after that, is a complete obsession. So put it off as long as possible.

Cumminnskiller, check my sig.

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post #9 of 34 (permalink) Old 08-28-2007, 09:10 PM
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I'll probably have EFI and a laptop next year anyways....
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post #10 of 34 (permalink) Old 08-28-2007, 09:10 PM Thread Starter
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do you guys get what I'm saying now though. That some people are mis-infromed when it comes to their diesels. That they don't realize to get that extra horse they need to do some fuel modications, some mods to the tranny, and other places. I think that places like bullydog, and quadzilla, and ppe need to start putting that stuff on the box that in order to achieve this extra horse you need to make these type of mods. I know bullydog, and ppe say if your gonna run the high horse power levels to modify the tranny, but what about the fuel?
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