2cycle oil in a Dmax? - Diesel Truck Forum - TheDieselGarage.com
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post #1 of 11 (permalink) Old 03-25-2008, 03:08 AM Thread Starter
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2cycle oil in a Dmax?

Just out of curiosity, have any of you guys tried "ashless 2cycle TC-W3 outboard motor oil" in your fuel as a lubricity additive? Alot of us Ford guys really swear by the stuff in our trucks. I believe there are multiple benefits to adding this to ulsd fuel besides lubricating the entire fuel system, since the btu's of this oil are close to that of no.2. It seems to make the fuel burn more evenly/completely and enhance performance. I don't know much about the dmax motors and if its even necessary to run any such stuff, but thought I would ask. Harry

Jan 03' built 6.0/F250cc4wd trqsft/SCT-tuned by KEM-Performance/Garrett Powermax vg-turbo/blue spring mod/gauges=egt+boost+fuel+SG2/exhaust/airaid intake/DR 4.5 lift/dual bilsteins/315's/greasable ball joints/powerstop/smittybuilt/kc lights/high idle mod/roll-n-lock/Mobil Delvac1 ESP 5W40 with (Archoil AR9100 in the oil) and (AR6200 in the fuel)
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post #2 of 11 (permalink) Old 03-25-2008, 04:50 AM
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I run just plain 2 cycle and sometimes some 5w 30 oil mixed with power service

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post #3 of 11 (permalink) Old 03-25-2008, 10:52 AM
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I started running 2 cycle oil about 6 tanks ago. Noticed that my engine is much quieter. Mileage, though, has gone down 2mpg. Not exactly what I was hoping for.
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post #4 of 11 (permalink) Old 03-26-2008, 03:49 AM
 
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The heui fuel system that the 7.3 and the 6.0 uses is a totally different beast than the common rail fuel system. I could see why the 2cycle oil in the fuel may help the injectors operate better on a heui but it probably would have no effect on the common rail fuel injectors. Clean fuel on the common rail design is the key. On the heui clean fuel and clean oil is very important.
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post #5 of 11 (permalink) Old 03-29-2008, 08:40 PM
 
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Yeah... tried that too on my D-Max and had not much of an effect at all if it did something, it was decreasing my fuel milage. Only thing good on the 2 stroke oil was she seemd to run a little quieter. Same with 5W40, but it'll run it no problem at all no sputtn or anything. I did the same thing in a VW PD TDI and it dind't like the mixture at all. Always spitted and sputterd on a cold start. Then I tried it on my tractor with a VE pump and there was no difference there either... :shrug: Best MPG I get is running with straight diesel, nothing mixed in and every 3 tank fills some PS to keep the injectors clean. :shrug:
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post #6 of 11 (permalink) Old 03-31-2008, 02:58 AM Thread Starter
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Thanks everyone so far for the replies. A friend of mine whom I work with just recently bought an 06' Duramax. He just put on the left side straight exh-manifold with banks dual exhaust and banks intake, plus ppe hot+2. I rode in it earlier in the week after the mods, and I must say, its a nice tire roaster, truck sounds/runs good. Anyway, seems that 2cycle is not too beneficial in the D-max as it is in my truck. Whats puzzling though is how you guys have lost fuel mileage. Sure its not due to winter mix fuel? Most of us Ford guys are running a ratio of 1oz or 1/2oz per gallon. And DieselMonk's VW dosen't like the stuff period. In my truck I used to use PS and then Stanadyne, but no more, the 2cycle is really amazing. Funny how the different injection and engine types respond so differently. Good info/knowledge on here from you guys, thanks. Harry

Jan 03' built 6.0/F250cc4wd trqsft/SCT-tuned by KEM-Performance/Garrett Powermax vg-turbo/blue spring mod/gauges=egt+boost+fuel+SG2/exhaust/airaid intake/DR 4.5 lift/dual bilsteins/315's/greasable ball joints/powerstop/smittybuilt/kc lights/high idle mod/roll-n-lock/Mobil Delvac1 ESP 5W40 with (Archoil AR9100 in the oil) and (AR6200 in the fuel)
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post #7 of 11 (permalink) Old 04-16-2008, 02:35 PM
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Quote:
I run just plain 2 cycle and sometimes some 5w 30 oil mixed with power service
Just shooting yourself in the foot... The oil is adding lubricity and the PS is stripping the lubricity back down again... You might want to read...

http://mopar.mopar1973man.com/2002%2.../HFRR/HFRR.htm

Quote:
I started running 2 cycle oil about 6 tanks ago. Noticed that my engine is much quieter. Mileage, though, has gone down 2mpg. Not exactly what I was hoping for.
This is typical with some engines. I would suggest trying backing down to the 200:1 ratio and seeing if there is a improvement...

Quote:
Yeah... tried that too on my D-Max and had not much of an effect at all if it did something, it was decreasing my fuel milage. Only thing good on the 2 stroke oil was she seemd to run a little quieter. Same with 5W40, but it'll run it no problem at all no sputtn or anything. I did the same thing in a VW PD TDI and it dind't like the mixture at all. Always spitted and sputterd on a cold start. Then I tried it on my tractor with a VE pump and there was no difference there either... :shrug: Best MPG I get is running with straight diesel, nothing mixed in and every 3 tank fills some PS to keep the injectors clean. :shrug:
The difference between 2 cycle oil and engine oil is the ASH content. Most all 2 cycle oil today is ashless and all engine oil has too much ash in it. So this leads to deposit build up on pistons and injectors...

As for PS it didn't pass the HFRR testing performed by DieselPlace.com To make a passing grade you need a <520HFRR and PS scored 575 HFRR! It creates more wear than it protects...:

Michael Nelson - 2002 Dodge Cummins & 1996 Dodge Ram 5.9L Gasser
116K Miles On My VP44 - 4 Years of 2 Cycle Oil Diet! - Mixed at 128:1 Ratio - 25.3 MPG maxed out!
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post #8 of 11 (permalink) Old 04-19-2008, 11:59 PM
 
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I just went through a tank with a mix of 200:1 two stroke oil last week. You're right, it burned better than 128:1. Right now I filled it with diesel and added PS, no 2 stroke. Drove a half of a tank and now there is no milage difference only noise. Must have something to do with the multiple injections.
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post #9 of 11 (permalink) Old 04-20-2008, 03:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DieselMonk
I just went through a tank with a mix of 200:1 two stroke oil last week. You're right, it burned better than 128:1. Right now I filled it with diesel and added PS, no 2 stroke. Drove a half of a tank and now there is no milage difference only noise. Must have something to do with the multiple injections.
Theres several factor occuring...

BTU Difference in additives... Take a look... :wow
http://mopar.mopar1973man.com/2002%2...l/btus/btu.htm

Cetane difference
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mopar1973Man.com
There is no benefit to using a higher cetane number fuel than is specified by the engine's manufacturer. The ASTM Standard Specification for Diesel Fuel Oils (D-975) states, "The cetane number requirements depend on engine design, size, nature of speed and load variations, and on starting and atmospheric conditions. Increase in cetane number over values actually required does not materially improve engine performance. Accordingly, the cetane number specified should be as low as possible to insure maximum fuel availability." This quote underscores the importance of matching engine cetane requirements with fuel cetane number!!!


At least for a Cummins is 40 cetane in the summer and 45 cetane in the winter time... But Chevron diesel is 43 in the summer and 47 in the winter time... This is a very good reason to STOP using PS cetane booster or Diesel Kleen (also cetane booster).

Cetane improvers modify combustion in the engine. They encourage early ignition of the fuel. They encourage premature combustion and excessive rate (faster burn rate) of pressure increase in the combustion cycle. This create that heavy Knock and that why with the 2 cycle oil is reduces the cetane level a bit and the knock leaves (burns slower).

Michael Nelson - 2002 Dodge Cummins & 1996 Dodge Ram 5.9L Gasser
116K Miles On My VP44 - 4 Years of 2 Cycle Oil Diet! - Mixed at 128:1 Ratio - 25.3 MPG maxed out!
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post #10 of 11 (permalink) Old 05-01-2008, 10:33 AM
 
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very interesting stuff on your website about that 2 cycle oil. :Thumbup: I find it works well with older style diesels at 128:1 but the newer type with multple injections likes 200:1 better. 128:1 or 100:1 decreases performance in my LBZ. Question is: how much do we actually drop the cteane numbers by using lets say 128:1 or 200:1 2 cycle??? That's probably why too much 2 stroke oil isnt good either in our diesels as it drops the cetane rating too low? :
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