Overloaded trucking a continued saga - Diesel Truck Forum - TheDieselGarage.com
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post #1 of 26 (permalink) Old 12-01-2009, 01:23 PM Thread Starter
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Overloaded trucking a continued saga

This should make some people happy> I am starting a new thread so the off topic thhead about will FORD ever offer a 6 Speed manual can get back on topic. and so others won't get their undies in a bunch.

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post #2 of 26 (permalink) Old 12-01-2009, 01:46 PM
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Thank you. Now my undies are unwound, feels much better

As far as the topic goes, I have seen on three different occasions here in Norcal deadly accidents from people driving an SUV with a RV that was over the weight (manufactures GCVW) of the SUV. There are two grades here that are short but steep and these drivers get out of control and flip thier trucks. In one instance the guys two little girls were ejected and killed. This is the kind of stuff that needs to be stopped.

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post #3 of 26 (permalink) Old 12-01-2009, 02:15 PM Thread Starter
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I am glad to help. Yes overloaded pickup trucks are completely different than a overloaded Semi that just needs a overload permit. Pickup trucks that are overloaded are just plain dangerous.Most accidents in my part of the country happen when the overloaded truck. can not stop or flips on it's side while turning or pulling over on to a soft shoulder of the road. It happens a lot with the farmers trying to get everylast bit of grain into the haul box than they drive the wobbly thing back to the farm too fast and it turns over. Spilling it all over the road. now the clean up comes lost grain lost time cleanup costs fines from the state cops county cleanup the drainage ditch. all for what? no profit in lost product.
You must admit though that the Manual argument was like a moot point. The manual is DEAD for now. Get used to it.Learn new things. Adapt,Expand your horizons, And smile moreYou will survive.

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post #4 of 26 (permalink) Old 12-01-2009, 11:57 PM
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no sir ,an overloaded semi is no different then a overloaded pickup. if anything it's even more dangerous. an overload that taxes a vehicles suspenson and tires is indeed dangerous, but many so called overloads are hauled daily and are within the vehicles axle and tires limits. same can be said for the trailer also.
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post #5 of 26 (permalink) Old 12-02-2009, 01:03 AM
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Originally Posted by navistar45 View Post
no sir ,an overloaded semi is no different then a overloaded pickup. if anything it's even more dangerous. an overload that taxes a vehicles suspenson and tires is indeed dangerous, but many so called overloads are hauled daily and are within the vehicles axle and tires limits. same can be said for the trailer also.
i have to disagree on this. how often do you 3/4 & 1 ton trucks hauling way more than they are designed for? it is not uncommon for these trucks to be pulling gooseneck trailers with hay,equipment, nursery,cattle & so forth with electric brakes that may or may not work when they need them to. i have hauled loads with my 1 ton truck that i shouldn't have but did anyway. i also have hauled cattle with a 50 ft. livestock trailer grossing 85K, while this was too much it didn't strain the equipment as much accordingly as the gooseneck does the ton truck.
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post #6 of 26 (permalink) Old 12-02-2009, 01:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by todt061458 View Post
I am glad to help. Yes overloaded pickup trucks are completely different than a overloaded Semi that just needs a overload permit. Pickup trucks that are overloaded are just plain dangerous.Most accidents in my part of the country happen when the overloaded truck. can not stop or flips on it's side while turning or pulling over on to a soft shoulder of the road. It happens a lot with the farmers trying to get everylast bit of grain into the haul box than they drive the wobbly thing back to the farm too fast and it turns over. Spilling it all over the road. now the clean up comes lost grain lost time cleanup costs fines from the state cops county cleanup the drainage ditch. all for what? no profit in lost product.
You must admit though that the Manual argument was like a moot point. The manual is DEAD for now. Get used to it.Learn new things. Adapt,Expand your horizons, And smile moreYou will survive.

I don't know much about semi's as I do not and never have had a CDL. But overloaded is overloaded. I would think that even getting a special permit would still require the truck (tires, axles, suspension, etc) to be rated to carry the load. I would think that getting a permit to go over these weights would put someone in a huge liability situation.

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post #7 of 26 (permalink) Old 12-02-2009, 03:03 AM
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Originally Posted by kwswan View Post
i have to disagree on this. how often do you 3/4 & 1 ton trucks hauling way more than they are designed for? it is not uncommon for these trucks to be pulling gooseneck trailers with hay,equipment, nursery,cattle & so forth with electric brakes that may or may not work when they need them to. i have hauled loads with my 1 ton truck that i shouldn't have but did anyway. i also have hauled cattle with a 50 ft. livestock trailer grossing 85K, while this was too much it didn't strain the equipment as much accordingly as the gooseneck does the ton truck.
You got that right! Thier are too many people with pick-up trucks either pulling or loaded with too much weight. I would love to see the local and state police step up and start giving out fines to these people that choose to put the public at risk.
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post #8 of 26 (permalink) Old 12-02-2009, 04:20 AM
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An overloaded semi still has to fall within the bridge law even with a permit. That is why they have more axles and the longer length. Most trucks have 40k tandems with a GVWR of 52k but on a set of tandems you cannot load more than 34k legally by law but a split axle trailer can have 40k legally. Grossing 85k in a semi is normal. The heavy hauler trucks are the same as any other truck except for the occasional pusher axle. A normal semi without a pusher axle can pull 150k or more with the right trailer set up but has to get a permit since it is over 80k. Even though the trucks are designed to pull 80k they are still safe pulling 150k. These are usually escorted not because they can't stop and are unsafe which are safe but usually because they are too wide or too long or both.

How do the manufacturers come up with the GCVWR? To get the GCVWR you take the truck's and trailer's GVWR and add them to get the GCVWR. I think that the manufacturers come up with the GCVWR so that it can pull at X speed and maintain that speed up hills. Because if you look the higher the rear end the lower the GCVWR.

So is a 1 ton truck pulling a bumper trailer that is tandem axle with singles with one braking axle at the manufacturers GCVWR max safer than somebody pulling a gooseneck trailer with tandem duals with both axles braking at the max GCVWR that is set with the truck's and the trailer's GVWR combined? You have 2 axles, 4 hubs, 8 tires on the gooseneck than 1 axle, 2 hubs, and 2 tires braking on the bumper trailer. More tires contacting the ground, better stability, better braking because of this. Bumper pull trailers lift the front end off the ground unlike the goosenecks that transfer some weight to the front axle. Most gooseneck trailer's can stop a loaded truck without the help from the truck. Some have electric over hydraulic brakes but most are electric and when maintained properly will work when you want them.

Our 1 ton trucks pulls a tandem dual axle trailer with both axles braking. The GVWR of the truck is 13k and the trailer is 24k so it should have a GCVWR of 37k. As long as we don't weigh more than our GCVWR of 37k then we are safe. Now if we were grossing over that then we wouldn't be safe. As long as you don't overload any axle or set of tandem axles and under the GCVWR of the truck and trailer's GVWR combined then your safe. That is what they will look at if an accident occurs not the manufacturer's GCVWR. The manufacturer's GCVWR is not set by law and exceeding that with the proper trailer does not mean that you are unsafe.
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post #9 of 26 (permalink) Old 12-02-2009, 04:36 AM Thread Starter
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The commercial weight restrictions are many and varied. I haul overweight all the time. the permit tells me what roads to drive on. the time of day I can drive and where I can park. Most roads have a weight rating when they are built. I am also told how many axles I must have on my tractor and trailer. that way the weight of the load is distributed properly. length of the commercial truck is also regulated by law. But Commercial trucking with a class 8 truck is a different ball game than running a over weight Pickup truck.

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post #10 of 26 (permalink) Old 12-02-2009, 01:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kwswan View Post
i have to disagree on this. how often do you 3/4 & 1 ton trucks hauling way more than they are designed for? it is not uncommon for these trucks to be pulling gooseneck trailers with hay,equipment, nursery,cattle & so forth with electric brakes that may or may not work when they need them to. i have hauled loads with my 1 ton truck that i shouldn't have but did anyway. i also have hauled cattle with a 50 ft. livestock trailer grossing 85K, while this was too much it didn't strain the equipment as much accordingly as the gooseneck does the ton truck.
a suspension system or tires that are overloaded is overloaded, plain and simple. someone teach me how to post pictures, and i can show you what a class 8 truck and dump trailer looks like that rolled from a spring hanger breaking due to being overloaded. i bought the truck from a local buisness, and my brothers wrecker service was the one that cleaned up the mess. it makes no difference in the vehicle or trailer. the real difference is the number of people hurt or killed, and the amount of money that get's spent when a big truck crashes. also, for those that think air brakes cant fail, you can think again on that one too. there is a certain amount of common sense that goes with driveing, and even more so with towing large loads, if one lacks the common sense to tow, and understand the issue's that can come with towing, they need to leave their trailer at home, or get someone that knows what they are doing to do it for them.
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