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Discussion Starter #1
Just getting started on the repowering of a 1971 Peterbilt. It's original 1693TA began leaking coolant into the oil, sustained a cracked head and six bad pistons on the top side alone. The plan is to perform some various general upgrades and repairs on the tractor while removing both engines. 3406c rebuilder yet to be determined. Perhaps a vocational school HS class that would, presumably follow thread and benefit immeasureably watching the truly fine mechanics that contribute their expertise at 'TheDieselGarage.com. The 1693 Caterpillar will be saved and eventually rebuilt as well. Photos of the '71, the donar with swap engine pics will follow shortly.

Roger
 

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Looking forward to this one :rock
 

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Discussion Starter #4
NUMBERS for the RECORD

'71 Peterbilt VIN 3 7 8 8 1
3406C Serial No: 3ZJ 3 1 8 3 8
Catapillar Build Sheet (SIS)
Standard 425 with the bigger guts and advance...
Serial Number: 3ZJ31838
Sales Model: 3406
Built: 1992-11-09
Plant: 40
Test Date: 1992-11-09
Shipped: 1992-11-16
Tested: BB
Test Number: 01
Cell Number: 11

Engine Test Cell Results
Description Reset Test Results Specification Values

Specification Number 2T-5173 2T-5173

Arrangement Number 6I-3474 6I-3474

Corr FL Power 314.8 kW 311.0 kW

Speed 2002 RPM 2000 RPM

COR FL F RAT 1101.2 G/min 1083.0 G/min

CSFC 209.9 G/kW.H 207.9 G/kW.H

Adj Boost 135.7 kPa 130.3 kPa

Fuel Pressure 272 kPa 270 kPa

Oil Pressure 448 kPa 429 kPa

TQ Cor F RAT 933.0 G/min 0.0 G/min

TQ CK CSFC 0.0 G/kW.H 0.0 G/kW.H

TQ CK Adj Bst 0.0 kPa 0.0 kPa

Torq CK Speed 1202 RPM 1200 RPM

TQ CK Tor TQ 2107 N.m 2083 N.m

LI Speed 705 RPM 700 RPM

LI Oil Press 249 kPa 217 kPa

Hi Speed 2209 RPM 2209 RPM

Response Time 0.0 SEC 0.0 SEC

FL ST F SET 0.00 mm 3.55 mm

FT ST F SET 0.00 mm 0.00 mm

Timing BTDC 0.00 DEG 0.00 DEG

FLS(Intercept) 0 0

FTS(Slope) 0 0
Complete Performance

(Grab all the tubing, upper and lower hoses, whole rad, ATAAC and mounts, and everything on the motor, including starter wires clear to the battery box and throttle linkage. Sad part is for another $1500 I can do the same in or out of frame to the 93 [but minus 1.5mpg which is the payment for the build in two years])

1693 TA Caterpilllar Serial No: 65 B 1639
Replacement head: 9s5545
4N6765
Remanufactured 0R0824 or
0R2089UTN

1693 arrangement No: undetermined
 

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Discussion Starter #5 (Edited)
Gentlemen: I was surprised to discover brand new, 3406c mechanical Caterpillar diesel engines manufactured in 2008 for sales off shore only. (export). I was more surprised to see the asking price of $44,000 and an additional $1500 if buyer wants a transmission oil cooler added. See:
http://www.impcorporation.com/Inventory/Details/Default.aspx?ItemID=4650&Featured=True

Two questions come to mind:
1. How technilogically similar is this $44,000 engine to the 1993 mechanical 3406c I acquired last week?
2. Should I be installing a transmission oil cooler on my 3406c or does it have one already? See pics below. And thank you.

Thanks.

Rogerstar1 :slap
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Spec Xref [3ZJ31838] July 01, 2010

Serial
Prefix Test
Spec Sales
Model Eng hp CB AS AC Speed Rating Ap Type
3ZJ 2T5173 3406C 425 DI TA AAAC 2,000 TR MR OWS

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
All Arrangment numbers for data for this test spec... Arrangement Arrangement Arrangement Arrangement Arrangement
4P1220 4P1221 4P1222 4P1223 4P1224
4P9270 4P9284 4P9285 4P9286 4P9287
4P9288 4P9289 4P9290 6I0102 6I0103
6I0462 6I0480 6I0833 6I1596 6I1764
6I2038 6I2039 6I3462 6I3463 6I3472
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Updating...
Community College - Technical School has had my 3406c 3zj Caterpillar for 2.5 weeks and not a word from them. A team of six students working 3hours on Tuesday and Thursday afternoons should be making some progress.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
Are any readers familiar with an aftermarket head gasket for the 3406c Caterpillars? Perhaps manufactured by Pittsburg Power or distributed by them at one time. I thought I had read someplace or been told that it is superior to genuine Cat head gaskets (OEM).

Anyone know it's name and whether it is better than Cat? Thank you. RD
 

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Discussion Starter #10
1993 Cat 3406c engines (at least the one I'm having majored/out of frame) had one piece aluminum pistons. Cat no longer supplies this part substitutuing a two piece steel top piston in it's place. Aftermarket supplier www.IPDParts.com can supply duplicate 1 piece aluminum pistons like my engine's former owner got 800,000 miles out of. CAUTION: If you ever re-piston your 3406 mechanical and are going with Cat Parts you will want to read and understand Cat Notice Number REHS3836. It specifies that with the steel piston you must also install the correct engine oil pump and Piston Cooling jet to avert catastrophic engine damage. I'll try and post the notification herewith.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Price of required engine oil pump and piston cooling jet, seals, o-rings, tubes, bolts, gaskets from Caterpillar? $1973 less $528 core charge. Time to reconsider OEM parts. IPD looking better and better to me. Students clamorng for parts to commence reassembly and a knowledgable source comments "I've heard nothing bad about the "IPD" brand of aftermarket parts for
Caterpillar. I think the pistons are actually manufactured in India
but they are close to Cat's specification. While rebuilding that
engine go the extra money and have the main saddles line honed, and
balance the rotating assembly. That engine can run almost as smooth as
a gasoline engine with precision balancing". Your comments here or by PM are, as usual, very much appreciated.

Rogerstar
 

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Discussion Starter #12 (Edited)
Humbled

The lateness of the hour (to say nohing of the subject matter's technicality) preclude much comment from me on the following message. I am humbled by the anonymous author's camaraderie and his willingness to help others, evident in these pages and at this forum among those who share and love the open road. And to again voice my appreciation for his and their generous spirit. Have a terrific Sunday. RD

Hi Roger, I would not be one to dispute another's judgment that makes
a living performing a given service like this.

Theoretically an engine exists as a design "blueprint" before
manufacturing. This blueprint is put into production and by the time
the engine is complete, (cylinder block in this case) it is subject to
manufacturing tolerances. Although slight, the main saddles machined
into the block can be just a bit out of perfect but well within
manufacturing tolerances and allowances. This can be bettered or
brought closer to exact as far as alignment with align honing the
saddles, or bores supporting the main bearings and thus the
crankshaft. Think of it like this: When an engine is running there is
a lot of downward force exerted upon the piston crown from ignition of
the fuel. This force is transferred into the connecting rod, bearings,
and the crankshaft causing minute deflection of the the shaft. This
force eventually causes slight wear through the main saddles of the
block. Again this is slight. Now imagine a rod bearing going bad. The
bearing clearance opens up, the force from ignition is now applied
through a larger opening "slamming" the rod against the crankshaft
harder and possibly deflecting, or distorting the bore. Align honing
will correct this if slight. Again this is hypothetical. If the
bearing bore is distorted above the point that a competent shop does
not think the bores can be realigned by shaving the bearing caps,
boring them back round, then honed to perfection, the block must be
replaced. To take this further: Imagine the lower end of the cylinder
block with the bearing caps installed and torqued properly. The
imaginary centerline of the bearing saddles are not in perfect
alignment with each other. If a round bar a couple of thousandths
smaller in diameter that the bore of the bearing saddles is placed in
the bearing bores, the main bearing caps torqued correctly, and the
bar rotated, there will be slight "drag" due to the bearing bores
being just a bit off due to manufacturing tolerances. This figure is
close enough to work, but can be improved upon.
Basicall what this does is "true" the bearing saddles into alignment
with each other. This allows the crankshaft to rotate more freely
within the bearings. I feel any reduction in friction is a plus.
I've never done a large truck diesel engine myself but have been
around several "pullers" the rely on expert machine work to allow
their engines to run high rpm's under pull and stay together. I have
built several race car engines, (gasoline), and pickup diesels, and
always have the blocks decked, squared, and align honed. The rotating
assemblies are then weight matched to less than one gram each. The
term decking, and squaring refers to having the centerline of the main
bearing saddles, and the cylinder head mounting surface brough to
blueprint specification in height. This is also referred to as
"blueprinting" and engine. The operation removes the manufacturing
tolerances, and brings the engine as close to design criteria as
possible.

The last 275hp 8.3 Cummins diesel I rebuilt cost $750.00 for the
balancing and block work mentioned earlier. The engine runs much
smoother than the original configuration. I would equate it to almost
a 454 Chevrolet engine at idle.

I'm surprised this service does not appear to be performed in the area
your truck is located in. It is quite common up here in central
***** and *****. If your engine did not have problems and just
needs "freshening up", it could be done without. A 3406 engine is
smooth in design operation, but I've seen them balanced and a glass of
water would sit on the cam cover atop the engine, not walking off from
vibration at idle.
 

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Discussion Starter #14
Motor is torn down with no catastrophic problems observed. Just normal wear. Parts from Cat and IPD aftermarket (a supplier of cylinder liner kits) are being assembled at the shop. So far so good.
 

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Discussion Starter #15 (Edited)
Balancing & Blue printing a 3406C Cat?

My correspondent adds the following on the requirement of oversized bearings. I'd enjoy hearing the views of other mechanics on the benefits of B & B procedures on Caterpillar engines including Tony (Ynot).

"Yes, oversize on the external dimension is required, sometimes. It is
however easily acquired via suppliers. Usually only .002-.005 is
required to "clean up" the bearing bores. There are also, (in some
cases) shims available. Most times however, the bearing caps are cut
on the parting surfaces where they seat against the block and the bore
returned to standard size. In this case, standard dimension bearings
are used.

I am a firm believer in the "blueprinting" process. The cost is
incorporated into a basic rebuild if the engine is mine no matter the
use. I've experienced the benefits first hand but cost is neglible
when compared to being out of service. Engines tend to outlast their
"standard" counterparts as all sliding, and moving parts are evened
out in wear patterns."
:rock:peelout
 

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oversize bearings are OK but don't let anybody talk you into shims or make up inserts , they don't carry the heat away
And only line hone if you need to ,it changes the gear train geometry if the caps are trimmed to make up for clearance
 
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Discussion Starter #17 (Edited)
'93 Airleaf and rears

1993 Pete VIN: 10W1179

Rear Suspension & Differential

front pumpkin:
Model # DS 402
Cst Part No. 3-03685-3C-0000
Serial no: 89231768-0000
Head #211710
Spec. 0406921
RATIO 3:70

rear pumpkin:
Model: RS 402
Head: 211540
Spec. 0407261
Serial # H-923176518
Cust Part No: 03-06387-2A0000
RATIO 3:70

comment:
"They just have a high ride height period as they were made for higher fifth wheel heighth. We buy the bags on sale from a local parts store at 90$ apiece,then bushing kits for the springs are 30$ x4.shocks are about 49$ apiece.the control valve for height is around 80$. This should cover all needed to get this suspension ready unless the U bolts holding the spring to the bushing housing has came loose or you break alignment bolts off in the bushing housing. Then you would have about another 400$ total in the suspension.Pete low air is a lower setting suspension but its way harder on bushings and is pricier to maintain as it has way more suspension travel. My thoughts on this is all of the Pete air rides are fairly hard on frames and I seem to see way more broken frames on Petes. I would enertain using a air ride off of a volvo due to availability and cost of repair. Also I have never seen a thin railed volvo with a broken frame.you have about the same ride as pete low air with lower cost and way more availibilty."
 

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Discussion Starter #18
sleeper door handle

I'm seeking one square door sleeper handle from the early 1970s Peterbilt line. Advise if you have one for sale or know someone who does. Cortland priced themselves out of the market at $80 for a delapidated one. Here is what they look like:
 

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Discussion Starter #19
Published by Lmackattack and borrowed from another thread.

"...no arguing that air ride rears are softer than springs, Most of the trucks I have driven were Macks, spring rear(auto lockers) with air ride cab and Im fine with that set up. At least the cab air bags will take alot of the hard shock out of the cab and if I ever get around to air front springs would just be a bonus. I have never been a big fan of air rears as the truck has to many pivot points and seams to squat and raise under braking and accelarating. makes the cab bouncy and gets stuck in soft mud easy. maybee Im still young and dumb LOL? the only advantage to air ride rears that I really like is that it reduces stress to the frame and cab. Takes the road shock out of the truck. But im talking off road mostly, for on road, Air ride is a must! saves the truck and your back!!"
***************
 

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Discussion Starter #20 (Edited)
Pyrometers & Transfer Pump Gauge

Originally Posted by Rogerstar1
What is an EGT Gauge?

And a T-pump pressure gauge is what, where does it's sensor fit and what does it tell the driver? What is considered a good reading?

thanks.
RD


Cody (SmokinCAT) states:
"EGT- exhaust gas temp., its also called a pyrometer, the sensor/probe can either be put in the exh. manifold(this is the most acurate) or after the turbo in the down pipe(figure a 200 -300 degree loss in temp versus in the manifold). This helps in the ability to tune the engine.

T-pump or transfer pump is what draws the fuel from the tank and feeds the injection pump, most readings are taken from the fuel filter base, and depending on what engine the readings may very. I believe on the B model it should be no less than 35 at an idle."

__________________
Cody.
 
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