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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hi,

Does anyone here know anything about the peak torque ratings for the Cummins V6-140-155 (VAL) and the V8-170-185-210 (VALE) series diesel engines?

I know off the top of my head the V8-210, which displaces 8.3 liters (8259 cc) and 504 cubic inches (from a 4-5/8" bore and 3-3/4" stroke) produces 178 hp @ 3300 rpm and 340 lb/ft torque @ 1800 rpm. These specifications I found were extracted from a 1979 Dodge DN-800 diesel truck brochure (for the Peruvian market).

The basic specifications for the VAL and VALE series:
V6-140 (VAL)
Bore x stroke (in.): 4-5/8 x 3-1/2
Displacement: 352.8 cu. in. (5781 cc)
HP: 140 @ 3300 rpm

V6-155
Bore x stroke (in.): 4-5/8 x 3-3/4
Displacement: 378 cu. in. (6194 cc)
HP: 155 @ 3300 rpm

V8-170/185 (VALE)
Bore x stroke (in.): 4-5/8 x 3-1/2
Displacement: 470.4 cu. in. (7709 cc)
HP: 170 @ 3000 rpm or 185 @ 3300 rpm

As you all might soon guess, the V-555 series (aka Triple Nickel) is derived from the VALE series (same 4-5/8" bore, but a longer 4-1/8" stroke). Also, just how reliable were all these V6 and V8 Cummins mid-range diesels?

If anyone can please shed some light on all of this, I would appreciate it.

Thank you,



Ben (Gillig8V71)
 

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Gillig8V71 said:
Hi,

Does anyone here know anything about the peak torque ratings for the Cummins V6-140-155 (VAL) and the V8-170-185-210 (VALE) series diesel engines?

I know off the top of my head the V8-210, which displaces 8.3 liters (8259 cc) and 504 cubic inches (from a 4-5/8" bore and 3-3/4" stroke) produces 178 hp @ 3300 rpm and 340 lb/ft torque @ 1800 rpm. These specifications I found were extracted from a 1979 Dodge DN-800 diesel truck brochure (for the Peruvian market).

The basic specifications for the VAL and VALE series:
V6-140 (VAL)
Bore x stroke (in.): 4-5/8 x 3-1/2
Displacement: 352.8 cu. in. (5781 cc)
HP: 140 @ 3300 rpm

V6-155
Bore x stroke (in.): 4-5/8 x 3-3/4
Displacement: 378 cu. in. (6194 cc)
HP: 155 @ 3300 rpm

V8-170/185 (VALE)
Bore x stroke (in.): 4-5/8 x 3-1/2
Displacement: 470.4 cu. in. (7709 cc)
HP: 170 @ 3000 rpm or 185 @ 3300 rpm

As you all might soon guess, the V-555 series (aka Triple Nickel) is derived from the VALE series (same 4-5/8" bore, but a longer 4-1/8" stroke). Also, just how reliable were all these V6 and V8 Cummins mid-range diesels?

If anyone can please shed some light on all of this, I would appreciate it.

Thank you,



Ben (Gillig8V71)
the 155 v6, should peak at around 280 lbsft. i cant recall ever seeing a 140 v6. as for the v8 170, i would suspect the 504ci was it's closest cousin. it was 4 5/8 bore x 3 3/4 stroke, it was rated at 210hp, 375 trq. specs on a 555 , go from 210hp/240hp ,trq 425/445. the very first diesel tandem my dad had, was a international with a 555. the old truck hated hills when loaded, dropping 3 to 4 gears was standard procedure. we ran that truck two years with zero issues. he flushed and drain the radiator one friday, left town for the weekend, and a norther rolled in, froze the block till it cracked. sealed it with liquid glass, drove it for another 3 months, then sold it. told the buyer to watch for the leak, he drove it another year and lost it to a bank. rarely see a 555 anymore, any v8 cummins for that matter.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
navistar45 said:
the 155 v6, should peak at around 280 lbsft. i cant recall ever seeing a 140 v6. as for the v8 170, i would suspect the 504ci was it's closest cousin. it was 4 5/8 bore x 3 3/4 stroke, it was rated at 210hp, 375 trq. specs on a 555 , go from 210hp/240hp ,trq 425/445. the very first diesel tandem my dad had, was a international with a 555. the old truck hated hills when loaded, dropping 3 to 4 gears was standard procedure. we ran that truck two years with zero issues. he flushed and drain the radiator one friday, left town for the weekend, and a norther rolled in, froze the block till it cracked. sealed it with liquid glass, drove it for another 3 months, then sold it. told the buyer to watch for the leak, he drove it another year and lost it to a bank. rarely see a 555 anymore, any v8 cummins for that matter.
There is evidence out there that a V8-185 HT (high torque) model is known to exist.

I have seen Cummins mid-range V6 and V8 diesel engines that are known to exist under the following designations, here and there:
352 ci V6: V6-140, V-352, V-352-C, VT-352
378 ci V6: V6-155, V6-155 HT, V-378 Phase 5F, V-378-C, VT-378
470 ci V8: V8-185, V8-185 HT, V-470, VT-470
504 ci V8: V8-210, V8-210 HT, V-504, V-504-C, VT-504
555 ci V8: V-555, VT-555, VTF-555, VT-225

The ones that are known to we Americans were the V6-140, V6-155, V8-170, V8-185, V8-210 and the entire V-555 range. The V-555 series bowed out in the early '70s to compete with the likes of the Cat 3208 and Detroit 6V-53N and 8.2L.

Receptance for the 555 range wore thin in the early '80s (evidence had shown that although the VT-225 was depicted as an option in some GMC Truck literature pertaining to both their Top Kick and Brigadier 8000 lines (the Chevy versions were the Kodiak and Bruin 80 respectively), apparently none of the two product lines were actually known to be specified with this engine). Cummins had temporarily abandoned the mid-range automotive diesel market until 1988, when they partnered with Chrysler Corporation's Dodge division to market a version of the revolutionary mid-range 6BT5.9 L6 turbocharged diesel engine (which was originally produced in 1983 with Case) in that company's 1989 Ram D/W250/350 series full-size light trucks. It was a success story (the 6BT5.9 actually outweighed the performance of Dodge's competitors at the time, such as the GMC 6.2L and the Ford/Navistar 7.3L, both tried-and-true V8 designs).

This may be veering OT, but I can hint that with the success of the 6BT5.9 series (both in the Dodge trucks and various other mid-range automotive applications such as school buses) Cummins had regained a sizable portion of their mid-range market share they had lost back in the early '80s.
 

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Euro Sparky/ Wrencher
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Gilling.,,

I dont know if you know this or not but anyway with old Cummins V-6 and V-8 series they used the same fuel pump as the larger series engine that used the same PT pump but sure they have same houseing but a few diffrence is the fuel pump gear size and couple of part diffrence each but other wise it the same all series with the PT system [ sure very large K series did used the same PT pump as well ]

but it been a quite a while but if i recalled they are wet sleeved as well [ not sure but i am pretty much on the hunch ] and the Jacbos compression braking was a optional item but that kinda a rare item like hen teeth is.

Merci, Marc
 

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actually, the biggest reason for the b series being such a success, was from lack of competetion. when emissions and a buy out , decreased detroit diesel sales, the new b series engine was a logical choice to fill the gap. there are only a few engine suppliers for off road equipment. chippers,skidders,tractors etc. engine manufactures, like cat, john deere, and ford, have a tendecy to keep their engines in there products. cummins, like detroit, was open to anyone who wants to buy one. the sales of b series engines in on road apps, are way behind international. the same can be said for the c series. everyone harps on the 5.9 being used in medium duty trucks , and being designed for that app from the get go, it wasnt . it was desingned for case equipment from the get go, with cummins retaining rights to sale for other applications. memory serves me, the first true medium truck application it was used in, was a ford. somewhere around 1992/93 . other then yard trucks, i know of no other truck it was used in at an earlier date, except for the dodges. i believe this to be correct?? this is not to dispute the 5.9 is not a good engine, and highly popular. few folks know, cummins went to gm and then ford, to buy the 5.9 engines. dodge was their last choice, and at first didnt want the engine. bet they are glad how things worked out..
 

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The triple nickle had a bad reputation in our area........the Ford service manager said they'd shake themselves apart due to that high RPM [3300}. The V 8 210- 504 " engine was better received 25 years ago .
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
junkmandan said:
The triple nickle had a bad reputation in our area........the Ford service manager said they'd shake themselves apart due to that high RPM [3300}. The V 8 210- 504 " engine was better received 25 years ago .
Dan,

For the governed speed of the turbocharged version offered under the model VT-555 (1976-1978) and VT-225 (1979-1982), subtract 300 rpms from the naturally-aspirated V-555's governed speed.

And how did the V8-210 (504 ci) earn, IYO (in your opinion), a better reputation than its decidedly infamous larger brother?

~Ben (Gillig8V71)
 

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Ben
I have a V504-C210 in a 1977 versatile model 500 (farm) tractor. It's rated at 192 hp. Can't remember exactly what the torque is, I'll check the spec book when I'm in the shop tomorrow.
In it's early years, (late 60's) Versatile also used the 352 V6 378 V6 &
470 V8. Unfortunately, I don't have the power specs for any of these.
The model 500 evolved into the 555 which used the 555 turbo engine @ 210 hp.
As to reliability...when the cummins V8s were in common service in farm tractors (few left now), there were lots of cat V8s around too (1150 & 1160, 3150 & 3160, and finally the 3208). Some preferred the cummins, others the cats. Some had good service from the V8s, but there were lots of premature engine failures too. In general, none of these high speed V8s proved to be nearly as durable as the better inline 6s.

edit... specs on the V504-C210: Max. hp - 192 @ 2850 rpm Max. torque 387 ft lbs @ 1900 rpm



Herb
 
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Searching for parts manuals for V8 185

Gillig8V71 said:
There is evidence out there that a V8-185 HT (high torque) model is known to exist.

I have seen Cummins mid-range V6 and V8 diesel engines that are known to exist under the following designations, here and there:
352 ci V6: V6-140, V-352, V-352-C, VT-352
378 ci V6: V6-155, V6-155 HT, V-378 Phase 5F, V-378-C, VT-378
470 ci V8: V8-185, V8-185 HT, V-470, VT-470
504 ci V8: V8-210, V8-210 HT, V-504, V-504-C, VT-504
555 ci V8: V-555, VT-555, VTF-555, VT-225

The ones that are known to we Americans were the V6-140, V6-155, V8-170, V8-185, V8-210 and the entire V-555 range. The V-555 series bowed out in the early '70s to compete with the likes of the Cat 3208 and Detroit 6V-53N and 8.2L.

Receptance for the 555 range wore thin in the early '80s (evidence had shown that although the VT-225 was depicted as an option in some GMC Truck literature pertaining to both their Top Kick and Brigadier 8000 lines (the Chevy versions were the Kodiak and Bruin 80 respectively), apparently none of the two product lines were actually known to be specified with this engine). Cummins had temporarily abandoned the mid-range automotive diesel market until 1988, when they partnered with Chrysler Corporation's Dodge division to market a version of the revolutionary mid-range 6BT5.9 L6 turbocharged diesel engine (which was originally produced in 1983 with Case) in that company's 1989 Ram D/W250/350 series full-size light trucks. It was a success story (the 6BT5.9 actually outweighed the performance of Dodge's competitors at the time, such as the GMC 6.2L and the Ford/Navistar 7.3L, both tried-and-true V8 designs).

This may be veering OT, but I can hint that with the success of the 6BT5.9 series (both in the Dodge trucks and various other mid-range automotive applications such as school buses) Cummins had regained a sizable portion of their mid-range market share they had lost back in the early '80s.
Allo , can anyone tell me if there are or where can I find a parts manual for the Cummins V8 185. I am in a process of rebuilding one of this engines and I really need that manual. Thanks
 
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