my trucks at the shop thay said im looking at $4,000 for a pump and dont have that kind of cash to spend now anybody know ware a cheeper place to get a rebuilt one or has them in stock cheeper the better times are tough
bayou hotshot
I think a 99 should be an ISC with a CAPS pump. If you post the engine serial number, I could find out for sure.
If it is a CAPS pump, Cummins is the only one I knoiw of rebuilding them.
The CAPS pump can be replaced in pieces on the engine (CAPS Modular Repair |Strategy)
If you get me the serial number, or can verify that it is an ISC, I can give you some more info.
If it is a CAPS pump, Cummins is the only one I knoiw of rebuilding them.
The CAPS pump can be replaced in pieces on the engine (CAPS Modular Repair |Strategy)
If you get me the serial number, or can verify that it is an ISC, I can give you some more info.
That site doesn't have your pump listed for sale.
Your pump has the lift pump built in. The electric pump is only to prime the fuel system for starting.
Your engine has the CAPS fuel system on it. Depending on what's failed, you can replace it without replacing the entire pump, or even removing the pump from the engine.
There are only 3 legitimate reasons for replacing the whole pump:
1. The rotor has seized, pushing metal in to the rest of the pump.
2. The parts are not readily available
3. The rest of the pump is original, and a decision is made to replace the entire thing to try and maintain a reliable engine
If your shop is not aware of the modular pump repair process, you probably have it in the wrong shop.
The price they quoted you wouldn't be too out of line in Canadian dollars, but seems high to me in U.S. Dollars... unless they included the core charge in the quote, or if it includes labour.
I'll try and post some more info and part numbers later.
Your pump has the lift pump built in. The electric pump is only to prime the fuel system for starting.
Your engine has the CAPS fuel system on it. Depending on what's failed, you can replace it without replacing the entire pump, or even removing the pump from the engine.
There are only 3 legitimate reasons for replacing the whole pump:
1. The rotor has seized, pushing metal in to the rest of the pump.
2. The parts are not readily available
3. The rest of the pump is original, and a decision is made to replace the entire thing to try and maintain a reliable engine
If your shop is not aware of the modular pump repair process, you probably have it in the wrong shop.
The price they quoted you wouldn't be too out of line in Canadian dollars, but seems high to me in U.S. Dollars... unless they included the core charge in the quote, or if it includes labour.
I'll try and post some more info and part numbers later.
Based on your symptoms, I think the most likely cause is a bad Injection Control valve.
There could also be a number of other issues to cause you the same symptoms.
See below for a lot more info on modular pump repair.
I would suggest that someone experienced handle this stuff. You local Cummins Distribuor might be your best bet.
If you think about getting in to it yourself, you should buy the CAPS fuel system shop manuals from Cummins.
ISC CAPS PUMP (Cummins Accumulator Pump System)
Complete pump # 4076441RX My Cost 4,472.05 Canadian +tx
Accumulator # 4025319RX My cost 1,201.32 Canadian +tx
Typical Accumulator failure symptoms:
-engine light on
-possible no start
-possible low power
Removal:
-clean pump and engine like an operating room
-Disconnect fuel temp. & fuel psi sensors.
-Remove bracket holding Accumulator to cyl. head
-Remove rate shape tube as an assembly with its' bracket.
-remove fuel vent line from top of accumulator
-completely remove 2 bolts at opposite corners of accumulator (the ones going in to cam housing) them remove the other 2 bolts 1 turn at a time, alternating between the two.
-remove both cam followers from the cam housing and look for damage to the groove in the follower, and the pin in the cam housing that the groove locates to. Reinstall both followers, making sure to line the groove with the pin. Failure to do so will scrap the cam housing module.
Reinstall:
-Replace both seals between accum ulator and cam housing.
-Install 2 bolts on opposite corners as during removal. Alternate bolts, turn 1 turn each time. Do not overtighten cam housing is aluminum.
-once the two bolts have drawn it down, install the other two bolts and torque all 4 to 50 FOOT POUNDS with a good torque wrench.
-Reinstall remaining components as removed.
Injection Control Valve # 4089661RX $1,103.59 Can $ +tx my cost
Typical symptoms: -possible engine light on (not always)-possible no start-possible black smoke-possible white smoke-possible runs rough -possible low power -possible engine dies
Removal: clean engine and pump like an operating room.\
-follow ALL steps for removal of accumulator
-clean around base of valve where it connects to distributor.
-disconnect wiring to valve
-remove all 6 screws which attach it to distributor.
-Remove plate under valve with two round crush seals, and be sure to return with valve for full core credit.
Reinstall: -clean out small holes under ICV valve with spray can of brake clean. do not use compressed air. no dirt must enter holes.
_use the two studs that come in the ICV kit and thread in to 2 of the mounting holes finger tight.
-Install the seal plate with rubber seals, 2 crush seal tubes, etc. in exact position the old one was in.crush seal must not be on an angle
_install ICV valve on top of seal plate.Make sure all seals are in place.
Install all 6 screws finger tight. torque in criss cross pattern to 16 INCH POUNDS
-torque in criss cross pattern to 32 INCH POUNDS
-torque in criss cross pattern to 50 INCH POUNDS
-retorque 3 times to 50 INCH POUNDS.
****torque is critical **** overtorque will damage the new valve******
-reinstall all parts as removed and per accumulator install instructions.
Distributor module : # ?? (computer down) price ??
Removal: -clean pump and engine like an operating room
-bar engine to #1 TDC as marked on fuel pump drive gear and gear cover(remove oil filler from gear cover)
-remove all fuel lines as 2 assemblies do not remove them from their brackets.
-remove rate shape tube as described in accumulator removal.
-Remove brackets as required
-Remove 4 screws which hold ditributor on to pump,, and remove distributor. catch rotor drive as it comes out. Don't let gear pump slide off its' dowel pins.
Reinstall: Inspect Rotor drive and back end of gear pump for wear. any play will result in poor engine timing.
-replace 2 seals between gear pump and distributor.
-Install new Distributor, making sure rotor drive stays in place .
-After tightening the 4 screws to 35 ft lbs, carefully remove the plug from the end of the distributor. DO NOT let the rotor fall out. Make sure the notch in the rotor lines up with the port that #1 fuel line was attached to. If required, remove the rotor and rotor drive, and rotate 180 degrees to line the notch up. If you drop the rotor or get it dirty, the distributor will be scrap.
-Reassemble other parts as removed.
Gear Pump: #4089074RX my price $674.43 Can $$ +tx
Remove: -clean everything
-follow all steps for removing distributor
-once distributor is off, remove the gear pump by slding it off it's dowels.
-don't let drive between cam housing and gear pump fall out. Replace parts as required if any play exists between cam housing shaft, drive, and gear pump shaft.
Reinstall: reinstall parts as removed, make sure rotor timing is correct as described for distributor.
Cam housing: $ 4009877RX my cost $721.94 Can $ +tx
-clean everything like an operating room.
-Remove complete pump Assy. from engine. You need a puller to pull the pump drive gear off the shaft. DO NOT remove the gear cover. Remove both the top and bottom brackets which hold pump to engine, remove the 4 nuts which hold pump to gear hosuing. Use puller to remove gear. The gear should stay in time as long as you don't abuse it, and pull it so far off the shaft as to dent the gear cover.
-Remove 2 seals between cam housing and gear housing. Follow other steps to disassemble other modules from cam housing and reassemble pump.
There could also be a number of other issues to cause you the same symptoms.
See below for a lot more info on modular pump repair.
I would suggest that someone experienced handle this stuff. You local Cummins Distribuor might be your best bet.
If you think about getting in to it yourself, you should buy the CAPS fuel system shop manuals from Cummins.
ISC CAPS PUMP (Cummins Accumulator Pump System)
Complete pump # 4076441RX My Cost 4,472.05 Canadian +tx
Accumulator # 4025319RX My cost 1,201.32 Canadian +tx
Typical Accumulator failure symptoms:
-engine light on
-possible no start
-possible low power
Removal:
-clean pump and engine like an operating room
-Disconnect fuel temp. & fuel psi sensors.
-Remove bracket holding Accumulator to cyl. head
-Remove rate shape tube as an assembly with its' bracket.
-remove fuel vent line from top of accumulator
-completely remove 2 bolts at opposite corners of accumulator (the ones going in to cam housing) them remove the other 2 bolts 1 turn at a time, alternating between the two.
-remove both cam followers from the cam housing and look for damage to the groove in the follower, and the pin in the cam housing that the groove locates to. Reinstall both followers, making sure to line the groove with the pin. Failure to do so will scrap the cam housing module.
Reinstall:
-Replace both seals between accum ulator and cam housing.
-Install 2 bolts on opposite corners as during removal. Alternate bolts, turn 1 turn each time. Do not overtighten cam housing is aluminum.
-once the two bolts have drawn it down, install the other two bolts and torque all 4 to 50 FOOT POUNDS with a good torque wrench.
-Reinstall remaining components as removed.
Injection Control Valve # 4089661RX $1,103.59 Can $ +tx my cost
Typical symptoms: -possible engine light on (not always)-possible no start-possible black smoke-possible white smoke-possible runs rough -possible low power -possible engine dies
Removal: clean engine and pump like an operating room.\
-follow ALL steps for removal of accumulator
-clean around base of valve where it connects to distributor.
-disconnect wiring to valve
-remove all 6 screws which attach it to distributor.
-Remove plate under valve with two round crush seals, and be sure to return with valve for full core credit.
Reinstall: -clean out small holes under ICV valve with spray can of brake clean. do not use compressed air. no dirt must enter holes.
_use the two studs that come in the ICV kit and thread in to 2 of the mounting holes finger tight.
-Install the seal plate with rubber seals, 2 crush seal tubes, etc. in exact position the old one was in.crush seal must not be on an angle
_install ICV valve on top of seal plate.Make sure all seals are in place.
Install all 6 screws finger tight. torque in criss cross pattern to 16 INCH POUNDS
-torque in criss cross pattern to 32 INCH POUNDS
-torque in criss cross pattern to 50 INCH POUNDS
-retorque 3 times to 50 INCH POUNDS.
****torque is critical **** overtorque will damage the new valve******
-reinstall all parts as removed and per accumulator install instructions.
Distributor module : # ?? (computer down) price ??
Removal: -clean pump and engine like an operating room
-bar engine to #1 TDC as marked on fuel pump drive gear and gear cover(remove oil filler from gear cover)
-remove all fuel lines as 2 assemblies do not remove them from their brackets.
-remove rate shape tube as described in accumulator removal.
-Remove brackets as required
-Remove 4 screws which hold ditributor on to pump,, and remove distributor. catch rotor drive as it comes out. Don't let gear pump slide off its' dowel pins.
Reinstall: Inspect Rotor drive and back end of gear pump for wear. any play will result in poor engine timing.
-replace 2 seals between gear pump and distributor.
-Install new Distributor, making sure rotor drive stays in place .
-After tightening the 4 screws to 35 ft lbs, carefully remove the plug from the end of the distributor. DO NOT let the rotor fall out. Make sure the notch in the rotor lines up with the port that #1 fuel line was attached to. If required, remove the rotor and rotor drive, and rotate 180 degrees to line the notch up. If you drop the rotor or get it dirty, the distributor will be scrap.
-Reassemble other parts as removed.
Gear Pump: #4089074RX my price $674.43 Can $$ +tx
Remove: -clean everything
-follow all steps for removing distributor
-once distributor is off, remove the gear pump by slding it off it's dowels.
-don't let drive between cam housing and gear pump fall out. Replace parts as required if any play exists between cam housing shaft, drive, and gear pump shaft.
Reinstall: reinstall parts as removed, make sure rotor timing is correct as described for distributor.
Cam housing: $ 4009877RX my cost $721.94 Can $ +tx
-clean everything like an operating room.
-Remove complete pump Assy. from engine. You need a puller to pull the pump drive gear off the shaft. DO NOT remove the gear cover. Remove both the top and bottom brackets which hold pump to engine, remove the 4 nuts which hold pump to gear hosuing. Use puller to remove gear. The gear should stay in time as long as you don't abuse it, and pull it so far off the shaft as to dent the gear cover.
-Remove 2 seals between cam housing and gear housing. Follow other steps to disassemble other modules from cam housing and reassemble pump.
f/c 329 is a CAPS overpumping failure.
This means your injection pump is having to pump more fuel than it should theoretically have to.
I would make sure all the fuel filters are high quality, and new.
I would also inspect and clean the fuel screen inside the pump.
It is accessed by removing a hex head plug just in front of the Injection control valve
Make darn sure you don't get any dirt inside.
If none of these things help, I woulkd suggest replacing the injection control valve. It cycles at least once for each injection for each cylinder, and is the most common point of failure on those pumps.
Make sure that whoever does it keeps everything spotlessly clean, and torques the screws holding the valve exactly to spec. The valve is very sensitive, so replacing it without torquing is a waste of money.
This means your injection pump is having to pump more fuel than it should theoretically have to.
I would make sure all the fuel filters are high quality, and new.
I would also inspect and clean the fuel screen inside the pump.
It is accessed by removing a hex head plug just in front of the Injection control valve
Make darn sure you don't get any dirt inside.
If none of these things help, I woulkd suggest replacing the injection control valve. It cycles at least once for each injection for each cylinder, and is the most common point of failure on those pumps.
Make sure that whoever does it keeps everything spotlessly clean, and torques the screws holding the valve exactly to spec. The valve is very sensitive, so replacing it without torquing is a waste of money.
I have no way of knowing how many filters are on your unit without looking at it.
Generally there is 1 filter before the gear pump and 1 filter after the gear pump stage of the injection.
It would be pretty simple to trace the fuel lines and find the second filter, so I'm not sure why Cummins couldn't do so.
Generally there is 1 filter before the gear pump and 1 filter after the gear pump stage of the injection.
It would be pretty simple to trace the fuel lines and find the second filter, so I'm not sure why Cummins couldn't do so.
please see the attached pic. if the leak is between A & B, it should just be a matter of an o-ring and maybe 5 or so hours of labour.
if the leak is between A & D , it would just be 2 special o-rings and a couple hours of labour... but is usually isn't actually leaking there. It is usually leaking from the back side of the cam housing, from where the dowel pins are pressed in. the dowel pins wear and get jammed in the tappet and finally forced out.
even though bad, it doesn't require the entire pump to be replaced. just the cam housing which probably would be $1000 or less in parts, and as much as 8 hours labour.
if the leak is between A & D , it would just be 2 special o-rings and a couple hours of labour... but is usually isn't actually leaking there. It is usually leaking from the back side of the cam housing, from where the dowel pins are pressed in. the dowel pins wear and get jammed in the tappet and finally forced out.
even though bad, it doesn't require the entire pump to be replaced. just the cam housing which probably would be $1000 or less in parts, and as much as 8 hours labour.
Attachments
he's talking about an internal injection pump part that is subject to wear.
I suppose it's possible, but it is less likely given the fact that your RV probably doesn't have many hours of run time on the engine.
and no, I haven't heard of that shop, but I've never been south of New York state either
I suppose it's possible, but it is less likely given the fact that your RV probably doesn't have many hours of run time on the engine.
and no, I haven't heard of that shop, but I've never been south of New York state either
http://www.davco.com/pdf/parts/3105.pdf
http://www.davco.com/pdf/sales/F5118-FP382.pdf
I like these. The most coarse filter available is 50 micron.
http://www.davco.com/pdf/sales/F5118-FP382.pdf
I like these. The most coarse filter available is 50 micron.
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