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Discussion Starter #1
http://www.chevrolet.com/hd-to-hd-truck-comparison/

not trying to start a debate a war..Just wanted to share some info... I own both, and dont see the differences especially in the payload video's vs my experience on a daily basis. Acceleration videos I will agree, but not to that extent..maybe different gear ratio's, and not making excuses for the Ford. Not stating which one is better due to I feel both are better at one thing vs the other.. Good read, keep it civil like gentlemen so this thread doesnt get yanked.. Thanks guys.. Jeff
 

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I am starting to favor the ram and duramax personally because it seems to me that using things like a turbo with a 2 sided compresser with a single variable turbine will hike the cost of ownership versus the the others, i may be wrong but the morer complex and more moving parts there are just increases chances for failures. the 6.4 is the same 2 turbos = $$$ , i do under stand that the powerpotential is great and that they are good but it is just one more thing to cost $1000+ to repair
 

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Its funny how the Ford all of a sudden is out accelerating the chevy on the brake fade test. Also on the passing uphill I don't buy it when they were testing the dodge it was the ford hitting the brakes.

I do really like the new chevys. The new body style is growing on me.
 

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The article has a connection to a Ford commercial bragging about fuel mileage. Every independent test seems to have the GM ahead.
I tried looking for a comparison of the Dodge and the GM in exhaust brake. That would be interesting.
The only part about the Ford that bothers me is If they are making more power than the GM, and it is not going to the ground, and they are burning more fuel, it all adds up to heat, and will that become a problem in the future?
 

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Discussion Starter #5
The article has a connection to a Ford commercial bragging about fuel mileage. Every independent test seems to have the GM ahead.
I tried looking for a comparison of the Dodge and the GM in exhaust brake. That would be interesting.
The only part about the Ford that bothers me is If they are making more power than the GM, and it is not going to the ground, and they are burning more fuel, it all adds up to heat, and will that become a problem in the future?
between our two 3/4 tons...the Ford is averaging .5 mpg better pulling the same trailers daily. Same thing as to normal braking..about the same..same on accelaration..almost the same. Both are close. The Ford weighs more, and getting the power to the ground through the tranny still needs tweaking. Towing and stability of laod on turns is still better on the Ford. Exaust brake is much better on our GM.
 

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Tebow-in'...
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Jass', i greatly appreciate the time, effort, and shot-taking that you put up with when giving your real-world input owning both vehicles in as much of an apples/apples comparo as one could ever really do.

i always read your input as both trucks are some of the best that have ever been offered and that each has their own advantages over the other, albeit those gains may only be ever so slight.

...or something like that.


also, i didn't look to see if it's on their website, but saw that there's a 3/4 ton shootout in FourWheeler mag this month. i've only browsed it and haven't read the whole article yet.
 

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Do you notice a big difference in the turning? I drove the 2011 Ford and the turning ratio was really good but was curious how the GM was.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
Do you notice a big difference in the turning? I drove the 2011 Ford and the turning ratio was really good but was curious how the GM was.
I believe its close, but slightly better. I primarily drive the 350, LWB with the 325 60 R20's...that turns pretty wide.. My 08 6.4 dooley had the tight turning radius like the 450..that truck turned awesome..
 

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Bumper sag and frame twist test are way off, I've put 3500lbs in the bed of half ton trucks and saged about like the Super Duty did, and frame twists, someone has been playing with sway bars and spring packs acceleration and braking tests, are very easy to make a truck look bad, was they really running the Dodge or Ford on the mat going up hill did perhaps they turn the jake off going down to make the Ford look bad, its on GM's own site so you know whose going to look good before you even watch it
 

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some results were surprising. i just don't know how the GM guys can put up with Howie 'The D-bag' Long...


the guys over on the GM sections are having a blast with this one. i just can't take the test seriously when statements like "zero brake fade" are made. their are test results and there are impossibilities. i don't want to hear about the chest-thumping cheerleading of awards, just publish the results.

hey, i'm not saying the Ferd didn't get beat - it clearly did in the demonstrations. but i've done my fair share of scientific testing (not in the automotive world). publishing one set of scientific results over others can skew an assessment. is that what happened here? i dunno. what is a more relevant question is this: how many different tests were performed vs how many tests were shown?

case in point: Ferd did testing that wiped their butts w/ GM trucks. now GM does testing and, what do you know, they wiped their butts w/ the Ferds. ok. the tests look great so long as you only publish the results from the testing method that are in your favor...

remember in '03 when Ferd was showing the loaded drag strip test and it walked away from Cheby? neat. so then Cheby stepped it up. then Ferd. now Cheby.

i just default to this: what do i want to buy with my money? if i like the asthetics, ride, and creature comforts of the Ferd, how valueable is that .5 seconds in a drag race to nowhere? and if i like the way the Cheby looks and feels, then shouldn't i just buy that one?

so next year when the Ferd 'walks all over' the Cheby (by beating it by .5 seconds or sometihng :rolleyes:), does that mean the Ferd is better? only the person making the payment can answer that question...
 
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Nice post! Loved it. Maybe one dodge can get there numbers up to be in all the test!
 

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Strokin'
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Just watched those tests and even though they're corny and almost unwatchable due to those two guys talking (who is this Howie Long, acts like he's some big shot in the pickup market, pathetic actually - its guys like us who beat these daily in the real world), it shows some concrete facts that the magazines have been touting for some time now. I have a few questions/comments about these comparisons:

1. When the first batch of tests came out, the Ford won all shootouts with the lower HP tune. Then Diesel Power had the GM win a "second" comparison and the GM blows everything out of the water... Something tells me these mags and websites just grease the heaviest palm. I assume Diesel power heard that Truck Trend was awarding the Truck of the Year to GM and rushed out the article right before to cover their tracks or something along these lines. Diesel Power is such an empty farce of a diesel magazine anyway. There is obviouly something fishy about the results when they come in drastically different a second time around with a higher HP tune!

2. How come the Dodge wasn't involved in all the tests? I know the Ram would have won the engine braking test, but it wasn't involved in that one for obvious reasons.

3. The "zero brake fade" is a joke, however I own all brands in my business and time and time again the GMs brakes are replaced almost half the time of the Fords and even more on the Dodges. The test is a joke but there is something to this.

4. Of course comfort and noise levels are not measures, I'm sure Ford would walk away with that one.

5. The frame rigidity test was shocking. I know my Ford frames do twist quite a bit more than the others, but with a load on it actually caved some tin. That was the most interesting part in my mind.

I take interest in this because I will be purchasing a new truck for myself personally in the next year. Aside from these comparisons and shootouts, theres one thing I know first hand: The Ford has the most creature comforts but the GMs are more reliable long-term. If I kept my trucks to 60,000 km the Ford would be my choice, but as a long-time, three generation Ford guy I will probably be making a switch for my next truck. I have a few GMs that have over 160,000 km that my workers drive in the oilfield from 30C to -40C and pulling trailers, the only cost my GM had was front brake pads. The Dodges front ends and brakes are constant costs, and the trannies are not in the same league as the Fords or GMs. The Fords have been nickel and diming me to death, little things like 4WD not engaging, seat heat not working, navigation system glitches, squeaks and rattles, its enough to push me away. The Ford is the nicest to drive hands down for overall finish and comfort, this is why I drive the Fords myself and put my guys in the other trucks.

Thats my take on it, either way I'm sure Ford will step up its game in another couple years. Good times in the HD truck market.
 

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After watching that crap I puked, Kind of how a 6.0 does. funny they never showed them at the urea pump when the ram went by.:roflol:
 

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Ford did win all the preliminary tests, they were doing it against the 2010's when GM brought out the 2011 then they lost.
The true test will be when the new tow ratings come out that meet the SAE specs. That is when the real excuses will come out.
That frame twist test is something that is practical, Many roads are decommissioned, and they dig ditches across them. When I go out to get wood I go threw them all the time, a friend of mine has a new ford and he uses it every day in the bush and loves it. I will have to check his tailgate, to see if it is damaged.
 

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Tebow-in'...
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remember when we couldn't believe that factory pickup trucks were breaking the 500ft-lb barrier...?
 

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might be a dumb question, but curious ? Why don't we see fully boxed frames on medium and heavy duty trucks??
 

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might be a dumb question, but curious ? Why don't we see fully boxed frames on medium and heavy duty trucks??
It has to do with sudden catastrophic frame failure, metal fatigue, cracks, and difficulty of mounting boxes and accessories to fully boxed frames. They gotta flex, something has gotta give otherwise. Yes my F-150 was stiff with it's boxed frame, but the big boys gotta flex. Not seeing a 3/4 or one ton truck "give" a little worries me more , over time, than a crumpled tail gate. A few years down the road will show this, unfortunately for GM and their drivers. SO the F-250 twists more than the 2500. It is supposed to. The energy is used up on the torsion, not the welds, bolts, or mounts.:damnit
 

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A class eight has a 10 inch and better frame width. The cross members, are made to reduce flex not remove it, the suspension does not have enough travel, it needs to flex.
A cross member that has a tube shape has no flex, it must be strong enough to withstand the forces or it will break.
Every vehicle has to have a certain amount of flex, to help absorbing shock loads but to keep the geometry of the vehicle stable it must be controlled. To much flex in the pick-up box and it will distort enough to destroy itself. To much in the front and the steering is affected, and shock loads will cause a rebound effect, when the unit is under load. That would cause the wobble effect reported in the new Ford, when the road is twisting and has sharp turns.
I have not been under a new ford to really look but they may have used thinner high strength steel, and it is not supported enough to keep its shape under stress.
Ford has a history of trying things that did not work when it came to frames. The late 70's early 80's they cut holes in the frame to reduce weight and the frames sagged in the middle.
 
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...That would cause the wobble effect reported in the new Ford, when the road is twisting and has sharp turns. ....
reported where and by whom?
 
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