The Diesel Garage banner

1 - 20 of 30 Posts

·
Junior Member
Joined
·
44 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Hello all,

Just found out about this engine recently, and as the owner of an '89 Mazda B2200, I'm interested in possibly converting my truck over to this powerplant.

According to Wikipedia:

"RF
Naturally aspirated SOHC, 2 valves-per-cylinder, displacing 1998 cc with square internal dimensions of 86 mm bore and 86 mm stroke diesel RF engine was one of Mazda's more popular diesel engines. This powertrain is close related to the Mazda petrol FE engine sharing the same bell housing patterns and other block fixtures and dimensions.

Used also in the 1984-1986 Ford Tempo - Mercury Topaz, the 1984-1987 Ford Escort - Mercury Lynx and pre-2001 turbo diesel Suzuki Grand Vitara
Used in the Mazda Bongo and 1999 Mazda Demio
"

From that passage, it almost sounds like a "drop-in" fit, but is it really?

If you know anything about this engine, please enlighten me.

Thanks,



Elvis
 

·
Junior Member
Joined
·
51 Posts
From looking at a diesel escort I noticed that the injection pump was driven off of the back end of the engine, and the intake manifold went past the back of the engine, so basically it would not work in a rear wheel drive application. That is not to say that they didnt make this engine for rear drive applications.
 

·
Junior Member
Joined
·
44 Posts
Discussion Starter #3
Richarr9,

Thanks for the info.
This may asking a bit much, as I don't know the extent of your automotive knowledge, but did it even look like the gas engine it's supposedly derrived from?

BTW, failed to mention this earlier (sorry people), but it appears they now make a 2.2L version and that would be the one I'd like to use.



Elvis
 

·
Junior Member
Joined
·
20 Posts
I have a bit of information on these motors that you are talking about. For starters, I am planning on swapping a mazda RF diesel into my 86 B2000, which is essentially the same as your 89 B2200. The B2000 came stock with the FE 2.0L gas engine. The B2200 came with the F2 2.2L. The older b series pickups (78-84) had an optional S2 (also came in some Rangers) that was 2.2L. Overseas, there is also a R2 2.2L diesel block, which, just like the FE/F2 engines, is a stroked version of the RF.
There are several hurdles when swapping the RF/R2 into a B series pickup. The first you mentioned is the intake and something will have to be fabbed up. Now there is a RWD intake that does bolt onto the head which would solve some issues. Another issue is the flywheel for the escort will not work with the clutch for the B series. The B series flywheel is 6 bolt, the diesel is 8 bolt. What you can do is take a flywheel from a kia sportage 95-2002 (which uses a mazda FE3 block, a twin cam FE engine) and use it on the RF crank. This will allow you to use the B series clutch/pp.
As if there were not enough issues, you would have to fab up a new exhaust manifold as well. Reason being is that the stock RF exhaust manni points down directly where the starter sits.
Now, for the good news. The transmission, motor mounts, and accessory brackets DO bolt on no problem. The rest of the issues that is involved with swapping to the diesel is just wiring the glow plugs, running fuel line, and any other goodies about going from gas to diesel.
 

·
Junior Member
Joined
·
44 Posts
Discussion Starter #6
Emjay,

Thank you!
I was concerned about the tranny bolting up, so its nice to hear that no adapter is needed for that, or the motor mounts.
Do you know if the RF has the exposed front cam bearing, like where the distributor bolts onto our gas engines?
That's another concern of mine, as my F2 has been an oil leaker, due to that "feature", for the past 17 years.
I also remember the older diesel engine you mentioned.
It was made by Toyo Kogyo and we had one of those trucks at a diesel shop I used to work at....took Isuzu filters!

Anyway, I'll check out the link, and thanks again for your help.



Elvis
 

·
Junior Member
Joined
·
44 Posts
Discussion Starter #7
EmJay,

Should've checked out your link first.
I see now that the cam bearing is covered.

Thanks again, especially for the link.



Elvis
 

·
Junior Member
Joined
·
20 Posts
Well, an update. The engine is not in the vehicle running yet. Check on the above link to see how I'm overcomming some of the mentioned articles. Just a taste,
Exhaust Manifold
Before:

During alteration:

After:


Intake Manifold[/1]
Before:

During:


After: (note still cleaning up and smoothing out surfaces)


And how it sits on the head:
Before:


After:
 

·
Junior Member
Joined
·
44 Posts
Discussion Starter #9
...by the way, you have a wonderful looking piece of property, too.
Reminds me of out here!

As always, appreciate the updates.



Elvis
 

·
Junior Member
Joined
·
44 Posts
Discussion Starter #11
Hey all, I am new here but it sounds like you should have gotten a 2.2 S2 perkins instead. It would bolt right up to your 2200 tranny. Good luck!
Ok, so just to cover all bases, I looked up this "S2" engine.
I found out its a licensed built version of a Perkins 4.135.
When I looked up a Perkins 4.135, I found a Wiki page listing a whole bunch of Perkins engines.
Here's what they had to say about the "S2"...

"Based on 4.154.Produced only by Toyo Kogyo. (Mazda) Variant used in '82-'84 B2200 trucks and in '83-'84 Ford Ranger Diesels. Pushrod, dry sleeves and gear drive"

I've talked with owners of older Mazda diesel pick-ups before and some have complained of cylinder head sealing/cracking problems, not unlike those I've dealt with concerning Cummins 470 V-8's, in the past.

I think, in this case, it may be the smarter move to go with the RF/R2.

Thanks for your input, though, 89b2600diesel.



Elvis
 

·
Junior Member
Joined
·
20 Posts
Well the perkins diesel is heavier and gets less fuel efficiency than a completed RF is supposed to gain. It has been a lot of work for me, I still need to get the head sent back to the machine shop to use my copper head gasket that I got made. I'm trying to bump the compression down to 16-18 range and also had to compensate for the shaving that was done to the head over the years.
The RF diesels are also infamous for cracking heads if they are allowed to overheat, and parts can be interesting to find at times. What I have heard though about these motors is that kept in tune and well maintained they go on forever and you'll only get 40mpg on a bad day. upper 50's to low 60's is common.
 

·
Junior Member
Joined
·
44 Posts
Discussion Starter #14
Well the perkins diesel is heavier and gets less fuel efficiency than a completed RF is supposed to gain. It has been a lot of work for me, I still need to get the head sent back to the machine shop to use my copper head gasket that I got made. I'm trying to bump the compression down to 16-18 range and also had to compensate for the shaving that was done to the head over the years.
The RF diesels are also infamous for cracking heads if they are allowed to overheat, and parts can be interesting to find at times. What I have heard though about these motors is that kept in tune and well maintained they go on forever and you'll only get 40mpg on a bad day. upper 50's to low 60's is common.
I don't plan on neglecting it, Emjay. ;)
Thanks for all your help.


Elvis
 

·
Junior Member
Joined
·
20 Posts
Elvis, you may want to take a look over at my thread on my link for more in depth updates, however in order to use the RF in a RWD setup, you will need to get a transmission bell housing with the starter on the driver side of the motor instead of the passenger side.
The reason is that the starter will come into contact with an oil passage. This one:
 

·
Junior Member
Joined
·
44 Posts
Discussion Starter #16
Elvis, you may want to take a look over at my thread on my link for more in depth updates, however in order to use the RF in a RWD setup, you will need to get a transmission bell housing with the starter on the driver side of the motor instead of the passenger side.
The reason is that the starter will come into contact with an oil passage.
Emjay,

No time to check your link at the moment (but I will later), but quickly, if you go back to page 1 of this thread, you'll see that you wrote the following:

"...Now, for the good news. The transmission, motor mounts, and accessory brackets DO bolt on no problem."

(I've added a little highlighting to help address my question)

So the stock tranny will bolt up, or not?
Granted, a new flywheel will be needed, but now you're saying I will need a different bellhousing.
So the original bellhousing (bolts to F2 gas engine) won't bolt up, or would IF the oil passage on the RF wasn't in the way?



Elvis
 

·
Junior Member
Joined
·
20 Posts
yes, the transmission does bolt up to the back of the block with no problem whatsoever. The problem lies with that oil passage on the side of the bloock. it sticks out too far that the starter can not sit in the transmission like it should. the bellhousing that I am getting has the exact same pattern, except the starter goes on the other side of the block. If you were to do this motor from an escort like I did, and use the stock B series transmission, you would have to get that passage surfaced down so the starter can sit, and to put in a threaded plug or something. Had I have known this I would have had my machinist do that, however my block was already assembled before I figured this out.
 

·
Junior Member
Joined
·
20 Posts
Here is a picture of the RF block I pulled from the escort mated up to the stock B series trannie. I took this picture when I first got the block over a year ago. This was before I noticed that the starter wouldn't clear the oil passage.


I will also take a picture later of the back of the RF block with the transmission plate in place to get another angle of the pic. I'd put the trans up to it itself however I am currently on medical leave because of my back.
 

·
Junior Member
Joined
·
44 Posts
Discussion Starter #19
Emjay,

Thank you for taking the time to explain that.
I see what you're getting at now.
Good luck with your back, too (been there!)


Elvis
 

·
Junior Member
Joined
·
20 Posts
Not a problem. I'll go ahead and post major updates to my conversion in a new thread here when I make one. Any interested followers can follow all the minor and major developments on my link in the first page.
 
1 - 20 of 30 Posts
Top